Wales V SA team announced

[stud muffin]

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; George North, Jonathan Davies, Scott Williams, Liam Williams; Dan Biggar, Gareth Davies; Gethin Jenkins (capt), Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Luke Charteris, Alun Wyn Jones, Dan Lydiate, Ross Moriarty, Justin Tipuric.

Replacements: Scott Baldwin, Nicky Smith, Samson Lee, Cory Hill, Taulupe Faletau, Lloyd Williams, Sam Davies, Jamie Roberts.

Sam Warburton ruled out by training injury

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38085271

Glad they have resisted the temptation to start Falatau. Warburton does seem to be injured a lot. Too much time in the gym perhaps?

[Numbers]

I'm not sure why Liam is back on the wing.

Shame about Warburton.

[ALunpg]

Not a suprising selection glad they did not revert to type with Roberts in the starting team but not a suprise he is on the bench. Glad Sam Davies is selected on the bench ..he could be the go to 10 by the 6N.

The pack is as I would have guessed Francis getting the nod as the tighthead choice . Baldwin can feel a little annoyed but maybe Owens gets it on scrummaging Obviously Warbs was not in due to injury and Lydiategets the nod with Falateu bench as maybe he is not yet 100%.

For many the 1/2p / Williams revert is if we are honest not a suprise even if for many its not the best choice.I am just happy that both are fit and available and if this triggers North then that can be a solid back 3.

But none of this matters unless Howler and his team have a clear plan that can be executed.

[Numbers]

Not a suprising selection glad they did not revert to type with Roberts in the starting team but not a suprise he is on the bench. Glad Sam Davies is selected on the bench ..he could be the go to 10 by the 6N.

The pack is as I would have guessed Francis getting the nod as the tighthead choice . Baldwin can feel a little annoyed but maybe Owens gets it on scrummaging Obviously Warbs was not in due to injury and Lydiategets the nod with Falateu bench as maybe he is not yet 100%.

For many the 1/2p / Williams revert is if we are honest not a suprise even if for many its not the best choice.I am just happy that both are fit and available and if this triggers North then that can be a solid back 3.

But none of this matters unless Howler and his team have a clear plan that can be executed.

Baldwin is a better scrummager than Ken, Ken can throw the ball into the lineout more effectively and is quicker in the loose.

[Sandydragon]

Shame for Warburtn being injured but another opportunity for Tipuric to press his claim and I agree wth Stud that bringing Faletau back into the starting lineup (despite his superb performances in training) would have been asking a lot. Id rather remove Lydiate in the second half and move Moriarty to the flank.

Switching Halfpenny and Liam around - ho hum. I don't agree but the back 3 has picked itself so at least the right players are on the park. Also pleased that Scott Williams is at IC.

Otherwise the team is as expected. Biggar returning was inevitable, but at least Sam is on the bench so perhaps he will get meaningful game time. The front 5 makes sense.

Now it all depends on whether we have managed to instil enough tactical nouse to overcome the Bokke defence, whilst defending our own line. I fear this game will not go down in history as one of the greats; Id be moderately happy if we managed to win and showed some greater level of skill and tactical cohesion in doing so.

[stud muffin]

From Wales online

There has been a lot of talk about Wales wanting their forwards to replicate the handling skills of the All Blacks pack. It’s not that easy to pick those up overnight, but one man for whom it’s no problem is Tipuric, who has put in 22 passes in his two Tests this campaign, more than any Welsh outside back.

Another telling stat is 104 tackles without a miss this season. Turning those into gain-line winning tackles will be the challenge versus the Boks.

That is a very sad fact about how are backs have been coached. These are basically the same backs who used to play "the welsh way!

[Sourdust]

The 15 situation is increasingly odd. I tend to favour this combination, but last week gave me serious pause for thought. I thought that everyone agreed that swapping ½p and Sanjay had worked pretty well? Not sure what swapping them back so soon achieves?

I'm a Biggar fan but starting him in this one smells of fear to me. Facing such a callow backline at the nadir of confidence, why not start with our creative, confident 10 and keep Dan a on the bench as insurance?

Not happy about 6 but if Sam has a knock then fair enough. Can anyone explain what Roberts offers off the bench? Are we expecting them to tire that much?

[ALunpg]

Baldwin is a better scrummager than Ken, Ken can throw the ball into the lineout more effectively and is quicker in the loose.

Interesting points ... not my read of their performance. but always an open mind if there is some data.

[Son of Mathonwy]

I don't understand Leigh and Liam reverting after just one game - a game in which they had looked good (even if not much else did). But not the end of the world I guess.

Biggar's return is no surprise but I struggle to believe we can play an aggressive attacking game with him there. I hope Sam Davies will get a reasonable chance, but more likely it will just be a cameo.

I marginally prefer Scott vs Roberts, but how much ball will he get with Biggar inside him?

Shame to see Lydiate instead of Warbs, but no choice there.

Gethin as captain? I think Howley (and Gatland) are a little scared of AWJ.

A real shame we're not going to see any of Keelan Giles this Autumn. It would have been a little brave (and I'm not someone to accuse Howley of bravery) to put him on the bench instead of Roberts after zero game time last week. Which makes the decision not to give him a chance against Japan all the more annoying.


I don't expect us to win this. And even if we do, it'll probably be an arm-wrestle* which will tell us very little.


* Or cripple-fight, more likely

[bruce]

I'm more with Numbers on this, I've always had Owens down as better in the loose than come scrum time, and the reverse with Baldwin.

[ALunpg]

The 15 situation is increasingly odd. I tend to favour this combination, but last week gave me serious pause for thought. I thought that everyone agreed that swapping ½p and Sanjay had worked pretty well? Not sure what swapping them back so soon achieves?

I'm a Biggar fan but starting him in this one smells of fear to me. Facing such a callow backline at the nadir of confidence, why not start with our creative, confident 10 and keep Dan a on the bench as insurance?

Not happy about 6 but if Sam has a knock then fair enough. Can anyone explain what Roberts offers off the bench? Are we expecting them to tire that much?

With Roberts...is it purely a centre cover issue with someone who can fit in easy? There are alternatives but maybe this is one that they will feel is less risk..whether its right or wrong.

[Numbers]

Baldwin is a better scrummager than Ken, Ken can throw the ball into the lineout more effectively and is quicker in the loose.

Interesting points ... not my read of their performance. but always an open mind if there is some data.

No data, just my old eyes I'm afraid.

[Numbers]

South Africa: Johan Goosen; Ruan Combrinck, Francois Venter, Rohan Janse van Rensburg, Jamba Ulengo; Elton Jantjies, Faf de Klerk; Tendai Mtawariri, Adriaan Strauss (capt), Lourens Adriaanse, Pieter-Steph du Toit, Lood de Jager, Nizaam Carr, Uzair Cassiem, Warren Whiteley.

Replacements: Malcolm Marx, teven Kitshoff, Trevor Nyakane, Franco Mostert, ean-Luc du Preez, Piet van Zyl, Pat Lambie, Lionel Mapoe.

Jantjies has looked out of depth at 10 during the recent internationals, their team is quite inexperienced all in all, I feel better about a positive result come Saturday.

[Ross. S]

I feel better about a positive result come Saturday.

Define positive? A Wales win or a performance so shite it gets Howler sacked?

[Spiffy]

South Africa: Johan Goosen; Ruan Combrinck, Francois Venter, Rohan Janse van Rensburg, Jamba Ulengo; Elton Jantjies, Faf de Klerk; Tendai Mtawariri, Adriaan Strauss (capt), Lourens Adriaanse, Pieter-Steph du Toit, Lood de Jager, Nizaam Carr, Uzair Cassiem, Warren Whiteley.

Replacements: Malcolm Marx, teven Kitshoff, Trevor Nyakane, Franco Mostert, ean-Luc du Preez, Piet van Zyl, Pat Lambie, Lionel Mapoe.

Jantjies has looked out of depth at 10 during the recent internationals, their team is quite inexperienced all in all, I feel better about a positive result come Saturday.

He's just had limited game time off the bench. On form, he's a pretty good FH.
SA finally with the wit to pick van Rensburg, a real handful at 12, and Ulengo, a proper flier, on the wing.
Still - the team is in some disarray after Italy - good chance for Wales here.

[ALunpg]

Baldwin is a better scrummager than Ken, Ken can throw the ball into the lineout more effectively and is quicker in the loose.

Interesting points ... not my read of their performance. but always an open mind if there is some data.

No data, just my old eyes I'm afraid.

Fair enough ... i know that feeling... old eyes ..old brain..
young ambition ..

[Numbers]

Interesting points ... not my read of their performance. but always an open mind if there is some data.

No data, just my old eyes I'm afraid.

Fair enough ... i know that feeling... old eyes ..old brain..
young ambition ..

[ALunpg]

I feel better about a positive result come Saturday.

Define positive? A Wales win or a performance so shite it gets Howler sacked?

Does that qualify as a win/win

[Sandydragon]

The 15 situation is increasingly odd. I tend to favour this combination, but last week gave me serious pause for thought. I thought that everyone agreed that swapping ½p and Sanjay had worked pretty well? Not sure what swapping them back so soon achieves?

I'm a Biggar fan but starting him in this one smells of fear to me. Facing such a callow backline at the nadir of confidence, why not start with our creative, confident 10 and keep Dan a on the bench as insurance?

Not happy about 6 but if Sam has a knock then fair enough. Can anyone explain what Roberts offers off the bench? Are we expecting them to tire that much?

Completely agree. It feels a bit like Howley is unhappy at taking too many risks. Roberts offers very little except experience so I can only assume he is there to shore things up if needed. I certainly wouldn't regard him as a game changer.

[Numbers]

The 15 situation is increasingly odd. I tend to favour this combination, but last week gave me serious pause for thought. I thought that everyone agreed that swapping ½p and Sanjay had worked pretty well? Not sure what swapping them back so soon achieves?

I'm a Biggar fan but starting him in this one smells of fear to me. Facing such a callow backline at the nadir of confidence, why not start with our creative, confident 10 and keep Dan a on the bench as insurance?

Not happy about 6 but if Sam has a knock then fair enough. Can anyone explain what Roberts offers off the bench? Are we expecting them to tire that much?

Completely agree. It feels a bit like Howley is unhappy at taking too many risks. Roberts offers very little except experience so I can only assume he is there to shore things up if needed. I certainly wouldn't regard him as a game changer.

Really, I would say he would be perfect for impact with his size coming off the bench fresh, when the opposition tire, having to tackle a massive b@stard like him is not what you want.

[Son of Mathonwy]

The 15 situation is increasingly odd. I tend to favour this combination, but last week gave me serious pause for thought. I thought that everyone agreed that swapping ½p and Sanjay had worked pretty well? Not sure what swapping them back so soon achieves?

I'm a Biggar fan but starting him in this one smells of fear to me. Facing such a callow backline at the nadir of confidence, why not start with our creative, confident 10 and keep Dan a on the bench as insurance?

Not happy about 6 but if Sam has a knock then fair enough. Can anyone explain what Roberts offers off the bench? Are we expecting them to tire that much?

Completely agree. It feels a bit like Howley is unhappy at taking too many risks. Roberts offers very little except experience so I can only assume he is there to shore things up if needed. I certainly wouldn't regard him as a game changer.

Really, I would say he would be perfect for impact with his size coming off the bench fresh, when the opposition tire, having to tackle a massive b@stard like him is not what you want.

Indeed. Impact is the word. Especially when he'll be very keen to show everyone that dropping him to the bench was a mistake.

[Sandydragon]

But unless you replace Biggar at the same time, then our ability to attack with any fluidity disappears and whilst he is a big bugger, the Bokke aren't exactly shy of physicality and without any slight of hand, he will just be running at opponents on his own.

[Graigwen]

I seem to be the only person who enjoyed last weeks game, but maybe that was because at the end of a hard week's work I had filled myself up with beer by kick off time. Sure, we were very shoddy in places and conceded two tries we should have stopped, but we had key players rested or injured. Plus, I believe that really was the last chance saloon for Cuthbert. I do accept that he has been trying hard but it has not paid off. He has always had positioning and defensive shortcomings but these were offset by speed, power and clinical finishing. None of his positives have been visible for a while, he needs to go away until he can produce brilliant regional form. He does not even look as fast as a few years ago.

Tomorrow we have a good team out, with a strong bench. Francis seems to have suddenly improved and his demolition of the Argentinians was impressive, also he has shown he can play for 80 minutes. To be able to bring Lee on as a substitute is luxurious.

Halfpenny/Sanjay does not bother me if they have the wit to swap around during the game. Hopefully we can manage to give North the ball with just a little bit of space.

The backrow looks OK, although a lot of work will be required from Lydiate in order for Tipuric to have time to work his magic. These games without Faletau have shown just how much rubbish he clears up at the back of scrums and rucks. Those times last week when we left the ball on the ground and Japan walked round us and picked it up would not have happened if Faletau had been playing.

With Roberts on the bench I suppose the unsubtle strategy is to have him running at an already tired defence. With Biggar starting I guess an aerial bombardment is on the cards - I don't mind that but our tactic of aimlessly kicking long to the opposition defence is rubbish.

For the first time I feel just slightly optimistic about playing SA.

.

[Digby]

Would Wales consider splitting the back field with Williams and Halfpenny and using North up in the line far more?

I don't know I'd always look at doing that, but Williams and Halfpenny both work so hard and have such good positioning that maybe I would.

[Graigwen]

Would Wales consider splitting the back field with Williams and Halfpenny and using North up in the line far more?

I don't know I'd always look at doing that, but Williams and Halfpenny both work so hard and have such good positioning that maybe I would.

We are certainly not getting the best out of North, he almost always takes the ball while standing still or when surrounded by defenders.