RugbyRebels

fivepointer wrote: ↑Sun Aug 03, 2025 10:11 am Too much sloppy cricket over last 2 days. Some poor batting and bowling, not helped by dreadful catching and uninspired captaincy. Boy are we missing Stokes.

Worth noting that Tongue, despite his lack of consistency. has taken more wickets (19) than any other England bowler and has done it in 3 tests. The guy has got something.

He does, but those extras were poor and we wasted the opportunity to shoot them out for about 150 day one. Suspect he needs to get overs under his belt.

A very tough ask becomes even tougher with the top 3 back in the shed.
Eng. will rue all loose/sloppy stuff and spills, characteristics of a makeshift team tbf..

have to hand it to this team, always looking play and win. Brook was brilliant, but daft at the end. Root....sublime so far.

57 to win, 6 wickets left 17 overs to new ball..but drizzle delay.
JR still there - fantastic effort.

Galfon wrote: ↑Sun Aug 03, 2025 4:21 pm 57 to win, 6 wickets left 17 overs to new ball..but drizzle delay.
JR still there - fantastic effort.

Ooops potly

Great bowling India post brook

Shame for the crowd- great day… nearly

Brilliant from Brook and Root to get us into a winning position. Have we frittered it away? Smith and Overton hardly inspired confidence.

It's a pity, JR was going steadier towards his ton after HB loss, and Bethell had 2 scoring shots in 31 balls, not up to speed yet.

Once again, our batting digging us put of a hole that our bowling and fielding have dug. Still a touch more parlous than I'd like, given that we're effectively 7 down with Woakes's injury, but you'd like to hope that we can get 35 runs, especially with Smith at the crease.

Really hope we do, cause the Indian team have been increasingly shitty over the course of the series. Did not enjoy Deep putting a sarcastic arm around Duckett's shoulder and walking him off, nor whatever sledging was strong enough to get an angry reaction out of Root of all people. I did especially enjoy the expression on Krishna's face after he'd gloating in Brook's face about him getting caught, only to realise that Siraj had stepped on the rope and it was in fact 6 instead of out.

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Sun Aug 03, 2025 9:26 pm Once again, our batting digging us put of a hole that our bowling and fielding have dug. Still a touch more parlous than I'd like, given that we're effectively 7 down with Woakes's injury, but you'd like to hope that we can get 35 runs, especially with Smith at the crease.

Really hope we do, cause the Indian team have been increasingly shitty over the course of the series. Did not enjoy Deep putting a sarcastic arm around Duckett's shoulder and walking him off, nor whatever sledging was strong enough to get an angry reaction out of Root of all people. I did especially enjoy the expression on Krishna's face after he'd gloating in Brook's face about him getting caught, only to realise that Siraj had stepped on the rope and it was in fact 6 instead of out.

Puja

Fancy us to do it more tomorrow am than this evening. Must have been mega muggy which explains the ball hooping around.
But for extras in the first innings

Disappointing from Smith. Needed to shepherd the tail and instead gets out cheaply. In fairness, the ball is hooping around, but he's got to do better than that. Just waving his bat around outside off stump.

Overton out with a whisker of an umpire's call LBW and we're now one away from Woakes batting left-handed with one hand. Surely that'll just be a case of bowling at the stumps and it's game over. All rests on Tongue staying off strike and letting Atkinson bat, you'd've thought - Tongue does owe us a few runs from the first innings's bowling, so it's time to pay up by staying in.

19 runs isn't much to get though. If we'd held onto any one of our 6 dropped catches, we'd be over and done with now.

Puja

Doh. Could focus on mad extras tally, 1st innings fall away, Woakes injury, daft last wicket stand from India, dropped catches, Harry Brook mad shot. BUT credit India with brilliant bowling as soon as Brook went, and again this morning. Great game.


PS....Bethell's selection was dubious, lets face it.

Crying shame. Falling 7 runs short of the win, 6 short of the tie. Incredible effort from Atkinson, managing 10 runs and nearly 3 overs effectively batting on his own, with Woakes clearly only capable of being at the non-striker's end and finding running incredibly painful.

Just rewatched the Overton dismissal and we're incredibly unlucky - it doesn't look out in the slightest, the umpire took so long about raising the finger that we'd run a leg-bye before he gave it, and the DRS shows it's umpire's call by the width of a coat of paint. India wouldn't even have considered reviewing that one had it not been given.

Never mind - we had no sort of luck this test in general with Woakes's injury, but no doubt we've ridden our luck elsewhere, and the loss was much more down to our shambolic catching and Tongue's 1st innings extras. If both can be cleaned up, then there's hope for the Ashes.

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:05 pm Crying shame. Falling 7 runs short of the win, 6 short of the tie. Incredible effort from Atkinson, managing 10 runs and nearly 3 overs effectively batting on his own, with Woakes clearly only capable of being at the non-striker's end and finding running incredibly painful.

Just rewatched the Overton dismissal and we're incredibly unlucky - it doesn't look out in the slightest, the umpire took so long about raising the finger that we'd run a leg-bye before he gave it, and the DRS shows it's umpire's call by the width of a coat of paint. India wouldn't even have considered reviewing that one had it not been given.

Never mind - we had no sort of luck this test in general with Woakes's injury, but no doubt we've ridden our luck elsewhere, and the loss was much more down to our shambolic catching and Tongue's 1st innings extras. If both can be cleaned up, then there's hope for the Ashes.

Puja

My ire is directed towards the batting of our numbers 6,7 and 8 who mustered a pathetic 27 runs between them.

fivepointer wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:27 pm

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:05 pm Crying shame. Falling 7 runs short of the win, 6 short of the tie. Incredible effort from Atkinson, managing 10 runs and nearly 3 overs effectively batting on his own, with Woakes clearly only capable of being at the non-striker's end and finding running incredibly painful.

Just rewatched the Overton dismissal and we're incredibly unlucky - it doesn't look out in the slightest, the umpire took so long about raising the finger that we'd run a leg-bye before he gave it, and the DRS shows it's umpire's call by the width of a coat of paint. India wouldn't even have considered reviewing that one had it not been given.

Never mind - we had no sort of luck this test in general with Woakes's injury, but no doubt we've ridden our luck elsewhere, and the loss was much more down to our shambolic catching and Tongue's 1st innings extras. If both can be cleaned up, then there's hope for the Ashes.

Puja

My ire is directed towards the batting of our numbers 6,7 and 8 who mustered a pathetic 27 runs between them.

Hmm. Overton I'll forgive because he's not a batsman and got two absolutely belting deliveries for both his wickets. Bethell was clearly a selection error - he's such a talent, but it's a huge risk to drop an inexperienced youngster back into the starting XI off the back of lengthy injuries and just one red ball game in 2025. Smith was hugely disappointing, but he's got more than enough credit in the bank and anyone can have a crappy test as a batsman.

Dropping Jaiswal three times in his hundred, including Dawson's one on 49 where the ball went to him, flat, at head height, and he managed to let it through his hands and hit him in the face, was the key issue for me. Our second innings batting was heroic, but India should never have got anywhere near 396 on that pitch and that's what lost us the game.

Puja

I thought England were going to scrape over the line after Atkinson's shot was parried for six, and Jurel missed the stumps to run out Woakes. But Siraj was a man on a mission, and served his 5- for.

Both sides could look at each test and think of things that cost them and it could easily have been 3-1 to either side. But things really did even out over 24 and a bit days, and a drawn series was probably fair.

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:58 pm

fivepointer wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:27 pm

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:05 pm Crying shame. Falling 7 runs short of the win, 6 short of the tie. Incredible effort from Atkinson, managing 10 runs and nearly 3 overs effectively batting on his own, with Woakes clearly only capable of being at the non-striker's end and finding running incredibly painful.

Just rewatched the Overton dismissal and we're incredibly unlucky - it doesn't look out in the slightest, the umpire took so long about raising the finger that we'd run a leg-bye before he gave it, and the DRS shows it's umpire's call by the width of a coat of paint. India wouldn't even have considered reviewing that one had it not been given.

Never mind - we had no sort of luck this test in general with Woakes's injury, but no doubt we've ridden our luck elsewhere, and the loss was much more down to our shambolic catching and Tongue's 1st innings extras. If both can be cleaned up, then there's hope for the Ashes.

Puja

My ire is directed towards the batting of our numbers 6,7 and 8 who mustered a pathetic 27 runs between them.

Hmm. Overton I'll forgive because he's not a batsman and got two absolutely belting deliveries for both his wickets. Bethell was clearly a selection error - he's such a talent, but it's a huge risk to drop an inexperienced youngster back into the starting XI off the back of lengthy injuries and just one red ball game in 2025. Smith was hugely disappointing, but he's got more than enough credit in the bank and anyone can have a crappy test as a batsman.

Dropping Jaiswal three times in his hundred, including Dawson's one on 49 where the ball went to him, flat, at head height, and he managed to let it through his hands and hit him in the face, was the key issue for me. Our second innings batting was heroic, but India should never have got anywhere near 396 on that pitch and that's what lost us the game.

Puja

Bottom line is that the game was all but won an hour from the close yesterday- we’d overcome blunders and playing with a man down for most of the game. Brook plays a poor shot and thereafter India bowled brilliantly.

pompey-zebra wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 1:18 pm I thought England were going to scrape over the line after Atkinson's shot was parried for six, and Jurel missed the stumps to run out Woakes. But Siraj was a man on a mission, and served his 5- for.

Both sides could look at each test and think of things that cost them and it could easily have been 3-1 to either side. But things really did even out over 24 and a bit days, and a drawn series was probably fair.

Kind of, but in each of the last two matches we had India on the floor but failed to kill them off, to their huge credit I guess.

fivepointer wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:27 pm

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 12:05 pm Crying shame. Falling 7 runs short of the win, 6 short of the tie. Incredible effort from Atkinson, managing 10 runs and nearly 3 overs effectively batting on his own, with Woakes clearly only capable of being at the non-striker's end and finding running incredibly painful.

Just rewatched the Overton dismissal and we're incredibly unlucky - it doesn't look out in the slightest, the umpire took so long about raising the finger that we'd run a leg-bye before he gave it, and the DRS shows it's umpire's call by the width of a coat of paint. India wouldn't even have considered reviewing that one had it not been given.

Never mind - we had no sort of luck this test in general with Woakes's injury, but no doubt we've ridden our luck elsewhere, and the loss was much more down to our shambolic catching and Tongue's 1st innings extras. If both can be cleaned up, then there's hope for the Ashes.

Puja

My ire is directed towards the batting of our numbers 6,7 and 8 who mustered a pathetic 27 runs between them.

Bethell was a rogue pick but Smith just had a bad couple of knocks- this morning he’d have been better off coming out swinging tbh… rather than the ball

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 1:30 pm

pompey-zebra wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 1:18 pm I thought England were going to scrape over the line after Atkinson's shot was parried for six, and Jurel missed the stumps to run out Woakes. But Siraj was a man on a mission, and served his 5- for.

Both sides could look at each test and think of things that cost them and it could easily have been 3-1 to either side. But things really did even out over 24 and a bit days, and a drawn series was probably fair.

Kind of, but in each of the last two matches we had India on the floor but failed to kill them off, to their huge credit I guess.

That's true, but in the first test, India were on course to set England 450-500 to win but only managed a target of 370 odd which England chased down. Given they had 5 centurions during the match, but bugger all from the rest they probably feel they chucked that win away.

I think both sides can look at periods in the series and say "f only..." but overall they balenced each other out.

pompey-zebra wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 3:26 pm

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 1:30 pm

pompey-zebra wrote: ↑Mon Aug 04, 2025 1:18 pm I thought England were going to scrape over the line after Atkinson's shot was parried for six, and Jurel missed the stumps to run out Woakes. But Siraj was a man on a mission, and served his 5- for.

Both sides could look at each test and think of things that cost them and it could easily have been 3-1 to either side. But things really did even out over 24 and a bit days, and a drawn series was probably fair.

Kind of, but in each of the last two matches we had India on the floor but failed to kill them off, to their huge credit I guess.

That's true, but in the first test, India were on course to set England 450-500 to win but only managed a target of 370 odd which England chased down. Given they had 5 centurions during the match, but bugger all from the rest they probably feel they chucked that win away.

I think both sides can look at periods in the series and say "f only..." but overall they balenced each other out.

I actually think India had the better of more sessions and days than we did, but we did get ourselves in end game positions where winning was easier than drawing or losing!

Isnt it time cricket allowed proper injury substitutions?

Pant shouldnt have had to bat in one test and the sight of Woakes with his arm in a sling was utterly ridiculous. Is there any other sport where this kind of carry on would be allowed?

Seems to me if a player sustains a match ending injury they should be able to be replaced by a similar player.

fivepointer wrote: ↑Tue Aug 05, 2025 9:23 am Isnt it time cricket allowed proper injury substitutions?

Pant shouldnt have had to bat in one test and the sight of Woakes with his arm in a sling was utterly ridiculous. Is there any other sport where this kind of carry on would be allowed?

Seems to me if a player sustains a match ending injury they should be able to be replaced by a similar player.

I would agree in theory, but the problem is that there is the significant risk of Bloodgate-style fuckery with Test cricket, given the specialisations and the shifting state of the game and pitch over 5 days.

"Oh no, our number 11 Shoaib Bashir has gone down with an injury shortly before our fourth innings run chase! We shall have to bring on our reserve spin bowler, Jacob Bethell*, to replace him! WHAT. A. SHAME."

"This pitch is much more spin-friendly than we thought and our fast bowlers look knackered. OH NO, MARK WOOD HAS PULLED A HAMSTRING. WHAT A SHAME. CALL FOR REHAN AHMED AND NOTE OUR SADNESS AT HAVING TO MAKE A SUBSTITUTION."

I don't know exactly how it can be solved, but I have to say the current begger's muddle isn't working - it doesn't make sense that a wicketkeeper can be replaced for injury in the field (especially given Test sides usually field a hybrid batsman/keeper and bringing on a reserve may mean getting a higher quality of specialist keeper), but not a bowler. And, as you said, having someone who can barely walk come out to bat might be great drama, but it's not good player welfare, especially since they got rid of the option to have a runner (which I still don't understand!).

You could maybe do it by setting a rule that you are allowed one irreversible substitution, which can be made at any point for an injury assessed by an independent doctor. That sub has to come from a pre-named bench of two - one batsman, one bowler - the batsman cannot bowl, if you want to replace a wicketkeeper it has to be either someone on the pitch or you have a batsman/keeper on the bench, and the bowler cannot have a first class batting average above, idunno, 20? You can do sub fielders as normal, but they aren't allowed to field within the same circle as would be for a one-day game.

Probably a dozen things I've missed with that, but it's the only way I can see subs working and not ending up being a tactical sub by any other name.

Puja


*The 2024!Bethell where he was in decent batting nick

Bah !..
Bethell shows again plenty white-ball prowess.
Good to see Archer doing a bit before the big-one in the offing.
Another L though ..

342 runs = biggest win margin ever in 50 ov. (mens).
Dead rubbers can be a challenge but can't argue with HB's team.
Bethell & Archer contnuing to impress.