Unner twennies twenny twenny two

[sharvey44]

Job done by the U20s. FT 48-10. Left a lot of points on the park. USA were never really in the game bar a 10 min patch in the 2nd half.

Back to the championship next year. Some promising players but they’ll need to back up their performances in the 6N next season and then the championship to show that they can make the step up to pro.

[septic 9]

Job done by the U20s. FT 48-10. Left a lot of points on the park. USA were never really in the game bar a 10 min patch in the 2nd half.

Back to the championship next year. Some promising players but they’ll need to back up their performances in the 6N next season and then the championship to show that they can make the step up to pro.

I see where you are coming from but that last bit isn't right. Several from the U20 team who were relegated have cracked it all the way to full caps, and quite a few who came through after that. I see the U20s as a key part of a pathway, development pathway, not something where just results matter

TBH we do well if we stay top tier at U20, given the lack of top level exposure available to youngsters, made worse by the demise of the S6

They did look a talented lot for sure, but there was really no significant opposition. What I did like was when things were not happening they understood that reverting to an overwhelming strength, forgetting the flash stuff, would make the game very safe, and it did

[Big D]

Key thing is getting these guys game time at Edinburgh and Glasgow, or putting them into positions where they can earn time.

Hart has had some game time for Glasgow and McConnell and Currie look to have a shot at earning game time for Edinburgh.

Ollie B-L should be the 4th hooker at Edinburgh with a chance to move ahead of Harrison and then both ahead of Cherry from the end of 2025 who'll be 34 by that point. No reason Jerry B-L couldn't be exposed to game time if proven to be training better than some of the other LHPs too.

The Edinburgh coaching staff in particular need to be more open to trying the younger players.

[septic 9]

Key thing is getting these guys game time at Edinburgh and Glasgow, or putting them into positions where they can earn time.

Hart has had some game time for Glasgow and McConnell and Currie look to have a shot at earning game time for Edinburgh.

Ollie B-L should be the 4th hooker at Edinburgh with a chance to move ahead of Harrison and then both ahead of Cherry from the end of 2025 who'll be 34 by that point. No reason Jerry B-L couldn't be exposed to game time if proven to be training better than some of the other LHPs too.

The Edinburgh coaching staff in particular need to be more open to trying the younger players.

think you have your B_Ls the wrong way round Big D. Jerry is the hooker and should be getting game time next season absolutely. If he and Harrison step up Cherry can be restricted to training - if he is no longer a Scotland option then the others need exposure PDQ. Ollie is a TH prop, which is just as well and again bar Sebastian Edin are very thin on the ground there. He isn't and I don't think going to be Fagerson standard as an all round player but Fagerson played for Glasgow at 18, and OB-L is much bigger and stronger in the set piece at that age

You last sentence is on the money. Time for Edin to step up in player development, the best get through eventually but they really have consistently failed to get the best of their young players for far too many years. No doubt with an embarrassment of excellent back rows coming through they will stick with Watson etc. And have to wonder with McConnell coming through why they splashed out on bringing Bradbury back - the differenc e in work rate and pure rugby ability at the same age is startling

[Big D]

think you have your B_Ls the wrong way round Big D. Jerry is the hooker and should be getting game time next season absolutely. If he and Harrison step up Cherry can be restricted to training - if he is no longer a Scotland option then the others need exposure PDQ. Ollie is a TH prop, which is just as well and again bar Sebastian Edin are very thin on the ground there. He isn't and I don't think going to be Fagerson standard as an all round player but Fagerson played for Glasgow at 18, and OB-L is much bigger and stronger in the set piece at that age

You last sentence is on the money. Time for Edin to step up in player development, the best get through eventually but they really have consistently failed to get the best of their young players for far too many years. No doubt with an embarrassment of excellent back rows coming through they will stick with Watson etc. And have to wonder with McConnell coming through why they splashed out on bringing Bradbury back - the differenc e in work rate and pure rugby ability at the same age is startling

I really need to start getting them the right way round! I agree, it doesn't look like OB-L will be as good an all round player as Fagerson, but can develop into a decent international if given the opportunity to and if he takes it.

I think Bradbury is the classic SQ player OOC and SRU taking the easy way out by offering him a deal mixed with conservative coaches.

[Cameo]

I haven't managed to watch any of OBL. Sounds like you two have some reservations. Is that fair or is it more a comment on how high a bar Fagerson has set.

[septic 9]

I haven't managed to watch any of OBL. Sounds like you two have some reservations. Is that fair or is it more a comment on how high a bar Fagerson has set.

Of course there have to be some reservations over whether a kid just turned 18 can hack it at top level. And yes Fagerson has set a very high bar - best Scottish TH prop in many a generation. We have had stronger TH scrummagers (and he is certainly not a weak one)eg Iain Milne, but never anyone as good around the park since, well IMHO Sandy Carmichael - and that was a very different era/game. Fagerson's carrying, tackling hitting of rucks and overall work rate (including while playing 80min shifts). No-one has come close
But as I also said OBL is IMHO clearly better in the scrum than Fagerson was at the same age. That is a helluva place to start from. He carries well and works hard. I am sure he will be 2nd choice for Scotland soon enough - if someone has a severe word of warning to the Edniburgh coaching team

[BaldiePete]

if someone has a severe word of warning to the Edniburgh coaching team

And there lies the problem.

[Cameo]

Lost to Italy. 22-10.

I watched it and thought we were okay. Young pack actually dominated the scrums (though lineouts were an issue and competed throughout). Two of Italy's three tries were gifted to them too and the other was a coubter attack. OBL looked good as did the losse head and Brown at full back was good under the high ball.

Having said that, we had very little penetration in attack. I think we looked reasonably well drilled but just unthreatening. Passing moves behind the gainline and then the carrier easily tackled. A bit like Wales full team at the moment actually. The last few years when I've watched this team play it just seems that the other team has at least one exciting back who looks dangerous evertime he gets it, whereas we look like we are going through the motions somewhat.

Don't want to be too negative as appreciate a key thing it getting up to speed physically at this level. Someone like Freddy Douglas would have made a difference today too, but as with the slightly older prospects things look brighter in the pack than in the backline (though you don't need as many to come through in thr backlime I suppose with lower injury rates etc.).

[Scottish Caley Fan]

How did Reuben Logan get on @Cameo ?

[Cameo]

How did Reuben Logan get on @Cameo ?

He looked quite good. Nothing extraordinary, but was noticeably dynamic (and big). Definitely one of the stronger performers.

[Cameo]

Another big defeat - 33-15, but that doesn't tell the whole story. 26-0 down after about 20 minutes. At that point I was ready to write off the next 10 years (though we had shown a few attacking sparks). After that, still plenty of errors, but a lot lot better and you could see the strengths of the players.

Yule looked like the big carrier he has been described as.

Logan did decently.

Harry Paterson came on at half time and was great.

Unwin showed some nice touches including a couple of cross field kicks.

Jack Brown at full back looked good again, and the back three (amd Ventissi(?)) Showed more intent when carrying.

Front row subs were also strong.

Definitely shouldn't overhype any of the above. It was a very comfortable Ireland win, but at least you could see what they were trying to do.

[Cameo]

Another big defeat - 33-15, but that doesn't tell the whole story. 26-0 down after about 20 minutes. At that point I was ready to write off the next 10 years (though we had shown a few attacking sparks). After that, still plenty of errors, but a lot lot better and you could see the strengths of the players.

Yule looked like the big carrier he has been described as.

Logan did decently.

Harry Paterson came on at half time and was great.

Unwin showed some nice touches including a couple of cross field kicks.

Jack Brown at full back looked good again, and the back three (amd Ventissi(?)) Showed more intent when carrying.

Front row subs were also strong.

Definitely shouldn't overhype any of the above. It was a very comfortable Ireland win, but at least you could see what they were trying to do.

[septic 9]

yeah, without trying to over egg it, decent performance in the end, for a hour I guess. But that counts for nowt if you are not on the park for the first 20mins, and we weren't

Not convinced by Unwin on that display, sub (Wolfenden?) looked really sharp though. Paterson great off the bench. Typical Edinburgh 9, been poor when he starts. he has more pace than I thought tbf

Seems we have 2 good tight heads in the making

[Cameo]

A win vs Wales!! They lost two men (one to a twenty min red and one to a full red), so would have been disappointed not to win but still lots to like.

Standouts, among others, were Douglas (he's definitely ready for senior rugby) and Brown at 15. Logan is coming on too.

[septic 9]

A win vs Wales!! They lost two men (one to a twenty min red and one to a full red), so would have been disappointed not to win but still lots to like.

Standouts, among others, were Douglas (he's definitely ready for senior rugby) and Brown at 15. Logan is coming on too.

Wales had beaten Ireland last time out, so this looks a good win. It was of course but my goodness did we make hard work of it. Under the cosh from the off but survived went upfield and scored.
The 2 red cards were well deserved, but Wales managed the problem pretty well, then attacked us by mainly getting lots of quick ball by pick and go then spreading it. There's a lesson there.

Moving on, Douglas is a given. If he isn't starting for edinburgh post 6N then I fear I'd be telling his agent to find another club.
Beyond that I think there are actually lots of really good players but they are not really functioning as a team, and tend to do some things well in one game then address a weakness for the next but drop the initial good stuff! A bit like watching Edinburgh TBH

Logan will be a good replacement for Mann at Glasgow. I hope!

[BaldiePete]

I didn’t see much of the match but I saw the straight red. A brutal head hit by a 2nd row on our scrum half. It’s at about 6.40 in the highlights. Nice try just beforehand.

[septic 9]

lost 45-40 to France. French pack was ginormous and we struggled with their carrying and mauls - but held their scrum well
Terrific game to watch, right o the end (so smart by Unwin to take a DG rather than the pen in the last few seconds so the game had to restart and we had a chance to snatch a win!
Still to many falling off tackles or positioning not quite right, by my goodness they can attack. And Douglas is just a machine - all round game including a solo try bumping off defenders, but he is I think the best jackal I've ever seen at any level from any country. Yes, he is that good

[septic 9]

lost 45-40 to France. French pack was ginormous and we struggled with their carrying and mauls - but held their scrum well
Terrific game to watch, right o the end (so smart by Unwin to take a DG rather than the pen in the last few seconds so the game had to restart and we had a chance to snatch a win!
Still to many falling off tackles or positioning not quite right, by my goodness they can attack. And Douglas is just a machine - all round game including a solo try bumping off defenders, but he is I think the best jackal I've ever seen at any level from any country. Yes, he is that good

[BaldiePete]

Agree with all of that. Please Edinburgh, don’t fuck Douglas over. Get him in the team and let him kick on. With Ritchie and Watson leaving there’s a real opportunity for him.

[Cameo]

So the u20 World Cuo overlaps with Scotland's summer tour. If Douglas establishes himself with Edinburgh over the next few months and looks as good as we think he will, which should he play in?

I'm leaning towards the u20s. I think it makes a huge difference to the whole team if they have some sort of platform. Douglas isn't the whole of that, but he makes a big difference. There's an argument that he would develop quicker by playing more senior rugby though (though tournament, and leadership, experience might be good too). I think the key is that, if he goes on the Scotland tour, it needs to be with a view to playing not just training.

[septic 9]

So the u20 World Cuo overlaps with Scotland's summer tour. If Douglas establishes himself with Edinburgh over the next few months and looks as good as we think he will, which should he play in?

I'm leaning towards the u20s. I think it makes a huge difference to the whole team if they have some sort of platform. Douglas isn't the whole of that, but he makes a big difference. There's an argument that he would develop quicker by playing more senior rugby though (though tournament, and leadership, experience might be good too). I think the key is that, if he goes on the Scotland tour, it needs to be with a view to playing not just training.

its a tricky one. Douglas SHOULD have been playing for Edinburgh this season, from the off. Maybe not every week but lots of weeks. Had that happened I think the big team tour would have been right.
IIRC we had the same situation with Zander and Jamie Dobie - except they actually had has lots of Glasgow game time
What is different now I guess is that since the Glasgow pair we were relegated out of top tier U20and this summer will be out first back up there; and we have a really really tough pool. So I think the immediate priority will be to try to stay up, and that means captain Douglas, as well as any others who might look ready to step up after a close season rest and conditioning.
Douglas will need to be patient if it goes that way - I think he is very level headed. And his time will come, absolutely no doubt about that - elsewhere if Everitt/Edinburgh don't extract the digit

[septic 9]

In case anyone hasn't seen it or seen highlights, in the U20s v France, Van Wyk scored an amazing finish from a cross kick. How he got it down and stayed out of touch!


but may be better still, Freddy Douglas on the charge
https://www.youtube.com/clip/UgkxqAdgbG ... VbFxwVl5at

[Big D]

Douglas should go... to the world cup. The group is a tough one and it'll benefit him.

Everitt should go... anywhere that isn't paid for by the SRU.