RugbyRebels

Relative newbie here, and supporter of an unfashionable team (Sale) who are used to seeing players leave to increase their chances of playing at international level elsewhere. As a supporter of a “minnow” team, Sale regularly see players leaving to go to teams where they think their international ambitions are more likely to be realised. In a number of these cases it appears to fail miserably, and I wonder if those players would turn the clock back if they could.

From a Sale perspective, some “failed” players I’d gladly see back would be:

R Miller
H Thomas
T Taylor
T Brady
Cipriani (okay, a tad tenuous as he went back to whence he came originally)
C Fearns

Who would you gladly welcome back into the fold?

Welcome to the forum.

As a Quins fan, the blindingly obvious one is Joe Launchbury.

Generally we’re not bad at keeping our better players but that one still stings - especially since we kept Charlie Matthews instead.

Jono Ross was one of ours once too so I’ll include him.

I’m not sure that many of the players on your list would actually improve Sale all that much TBH? Fearns and Taylor and the tenuous Cipriani pick are the only ones I’d see as likely starters.

Ed Slater. Without a shadow of a doubt.

Puja

ETA. Good idea for a thread this!

Actually Thomas would start too

Good thread!

For Worcester I would have Gus Creevy, Mike Williams and Chris Vui back!

Matt Mullan would still do a good job for us at loosened as well.

Scrumhead wrote:Actually Thomas would start too

With Haley not having the best of seasons, and O’Connor ostensibly being a FH, I think Miller would be a contender for our FB spot. Particularly during the 6N when we’ll lose McGuigan

As a wasps fan:

Billy V
Piatau x 2
Loz

To be fair, I think we've done well with player retention in recent times.

I don't know if we gave Loz more gametime instead of sticking with Goode if that would have made him more likely to stay, but letting him go is one only big mistake I can think of. I love Cips and Gops but Loz had age on his side.

padprop wrote:As a wasps fan:

Billy V
Piatau x 2
Loz

To be fair, I think we've done well with player retention in recent times.

I don't know if we gave Loz more gametime instead of sticking with Goode if that would have made him more likely to stay, but letting him go is one only big mistake I can think of. I love Cips and Gops but Loz had age on his side.

Plus Kurtley Beale and George Smith. I know George was getting on a bit but he was still on another level to everyone else.

Just as a point on the opening post - I'm not sure how Taylor counts as 'failed' ambition. Had a cracking first season at wasps, got all the way to the prem final, got his England call up. Then got injured in England training and hasn't been fit since. In my book that means the move paid off and it's just his bad luck on England duty that has cost him. To be fair if tom Dunn is the best there is at 3rd choice I don't think Taylor is gojng to struggle to get back in the mix.

Miller clearly doesn't have any regrets either as he signed a new contract about a month ago.

From a wasps viewpoint - Billy? Meh. Maybe but if he hadn't gone we'd never have discovered Hughes. Billy is clearly the better player at international level right now, but at prem level i prefer Nathan. Just like I may want watson over wade for England but I'd rather have wade against prem defences. Plus Nathan actually wants to play for wasps.


For me it might be the fact we now have two ex academy props in obano and Williams in the England set up.

I'd also take loz back in a heartbeat. Jonah Holmes too - i like Bassett but Holmes is just as good and more versatile.

Hucks wrote:Just as a point on the opening post - I'm not sure how Taylor counts as 'failed' ambition. Had a cracking first season at wasps, got all the way to the prem final, got his England call up. Then got injured in England training and hasn't been fit since. In my book that means the move paid off and it's just his bad luck on England duty that has cost him. To be fair if tom Dunn is the best there is at 3rd choice I don't think Taylor is gojng to struggle to get back in the mix.

Miller clearly doesn't have any regrets either as he signed a new contract about a month ago.

From a wasps viewpoint - Billy? Meh. Maybe but if he hadn't gone we'd never have discovered Hughes. Billy is clearly the better player at international level right now, but at prem level i prefer Nathan. Just like I may want watson over wade for England but I'd rather have wade against prem defences. Plus Nathan actually wants to play for wasps.


For me it might be the fact we now have two ex academy props in obano and Williams in the England set up.

I'd also take loz back in a heartbeat. Jonah Holmes too - i like Bassett but Holmes is just as good and more versatile.

Cooper-Woolley is a far better player than Williams IMO, although would have Williams over Moore.

Ditto Mcintyre and Mullan over Obano.

Hucks wrote:Just as a point on the opening post - I'm not sure how Taylor counts as 'failed' ambition. Had a cracking first season at wasps, got all the way to the prem final, got his England call up. Then got injured in England training and hasn't been fit since. In my book that means the move paid off and it's just his bad luck on England duty that has cost him. To be fair if tom Dunn is the best there is at 3rd choice I don't think Taylor is gojng to struggle to get back in the mix.

Miller clearly doesn't have any regrets either as he signed a new contract about a month ago.

TT got his first England call up (and only cap) whilst playing at Sale, so I wouldn’t agree that his move has been a resounding success. Ditto Miller and Gaskell.

As Hucks said, prior to Taylor’s injury, his move to Wasps was proving to be highly successful.

If he was fit, in the same form as he was last season and still being overlooked you might have a point, but considering he’s been out of months due to injury and hasn’t been in a position to trouble the selectors, it’s unfair to suggest he’s not kicked-on because of anything to do with Wasps.

Might be worth pointing out that his injury was picked-up in England training too ...

Also, the vague nature of Eddie’s selections leaves us baffled almost every time a squad is picked. Taylor could be ripping it up for Sale and be overlooked just as easily as he would playing for Wasps. Exhibit A, Luke Cowan-Dickie.

Hard to say for Tigers.

Would take Ed back but wouldn’t undo the swap.
Lewington maybe, but his defense has been poor.
Gibson would be good for our Back row currently but not what we really need.
Salvi is getting on.
Parking is getting on.

Says something about the recent quality of players doesn’t it really.

Before Vellacotts emergence I would definitely have said Dan Robson at Glaws but, fantastic player he is, I'm not sure we need him now.

Similarly I would say that the emergence of Ollie Thorley, and the change to our game plan, means that we havent really missed Jonny May (although I'd love to have seen him play in the current set up). Thorley has the gas and physicality to become a top player IMO.

I'd take Freddie Burns back in a heart beat - we definitely saw the best of him and I still think he has a lot to offer.

For Wasps I'd take Hepburn from Chiefs. Been injured but he's a cracking player. And like Hucks I'd take Jonah Holmes too.

Devoto without question
Spencer, Woodburn and Bendy would be useful too, though no blame attached to any of them, or the club, for their departures; Devoto is the one I want to kick someone (MFord) for.

Tigersman wrote:Hard to say for Tigers.

Would take Ed back but wouldn’t undo the swap.
Lewington maybe, but his defense has been poor.
Gibson would be good for our Back row currently but not what we really need.
Salvi is getting on.
Parking is getting on.

Says something about the recent quality of players doesn’t it really.

I've thought of one - Matera. Although I'd like the one that's playing for Argentina, rather than the homesick one that wasn't able to click in England, so maybe that's not possible anyway.

Which Tyler wrote:Devoto without question
Spencer, Woodburn and Bendy would be useful too, though no blame attached to any of them, or the club, for their departures; Devoto is the one I want to kick someone (MFord) for.

No [redacted]?

Puja

Puja wrote:No [redacted]?

Correct. MFord takes his fair share of the blame as well, but [Redacted] still behaved appallingly with no dedication, and a putting of himself above his team.

As Bristol will need a stronger pack next year I'd have these players back:
Mako Vunipola
Ellis Genge
Dave Attwood
Jake Polledri
Billy Vunipola

With Marco Mama, Mitch Eddie, Jamal Ford-Robinson and Jason Woodword to add decent depth.

What's happened to Marco Mama?

Puja wrote:

Tigersman wrote:Hard to say for Tigers.

Would take Ed back but wouldn’t undo the swap.
Lewington maybe, but his defense has been poor.
Gibson would be good for our Back row currently but not what we really need.
Salvi is getting on.
Parking is getting on.

Says something about the recent quality of players doesn’t it really.

I've thought of one - Matera. Although I'd like the one that's playing for Argentina, rather than the homesick one that wasn't able to click in England, so maybe that's not possible anyway.

Which Tyler wrote:Devoto without question
Spencer, Woodburn and Bendy would be useful too, though no blame attached to any of them, or the club, for their departures; Devoto is the one I want to kick someone (MFord) for.

No [redacted]?

Puja

Waldrom? A back row of Slater, Salvi and Waldrom would be a huge step up from the current lot, wouldn't it?

Waldrom IMO is past it,he hardly made a impact v Tigers and Chiefs looked a lot more dangerous with Simmons.

ilovelamp wrote:
I'd take Freddie Burns back in a heart beat - we definitely saw the best of him and I still think he has a lot to offer.

This! I wouldn't be surprised given the turn of events at Bath

Peej wrote:What's happened to Marco Mama?

Season long ACL (I think) injury. Been a big loss for Worcester, he has been class when fit since joining.

As has been remarked, there's only really Launch at Quins. We're quite good at keeping the important players, it's just we can never replace them once they retire...

Recent departures from Quins who were first team players: NEv, Easter, Monye, Kohn and Robson, James Johnstone, Gommars, Dickson... All either retired or so shunt now they wouldn't get into LI's team...

But we replace them with Catrakilis and Alofa Alofa and Ben Glynn and Dave Lewis... Sigh.