Scots Abroad VIII (or let's spot the new messiah)

[Big D]

Hunter Hill was decent at the weekend too.

[Cameo]

This is interesting news if we are looking at the coaching pathway:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super ... -from-2024

[Cameo]

Sorry, couldn't embed, but basically Clark Laidlaw is moving from NZ Sevens to be head coach of the Hurricanes. Colin Gregor recently mentioned him as someone Edinburgh might be interested in.

[Puja]

Ben White potentially out of a job today - either of the Scottish regions got room for him, do you think?

Puja

[septic 9]

Ben White potentially out of a job today - either of the Scottish regions got room for him, do you think?

Puja

can't see a place at Glasgow, with Price, Horne and Dobie (plus Kennedy still a back up and young Ashfar in the academy looking ready to go). Besides any cash Glasgow has still spare needs to be on back 3 - Kyle Rowe maybe.

But White would IMHO be a big upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh. They still have Vellacott and Shiel and signed Scott Steele for next season. So would be a good signing, but whether there is budget is another matter

[Big D]

Ben White potentially out of a job today - either of the Scottish regions got room for him, do you think?

Puja

can't see a place at Glasgow, with Price, Horne and Dobie (plus Kennedy still a back up and young Ashfar in the academy looking ready to go). Besides any cash Glasgow has still spare needs to be on back 3 - Kyle Rowe maybe.

But White would IMHO be a big upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh. They still have Vellacott and Shiel and signed Scott Steele for next season. So would be a good signing, but whether there is budget is another matter

I think the SRU would find the funding for a year for White until they can balance the books at either club unless there is a club waiting in the wings to pick him up.

Price, Shiel and Steele are all out of contract next summer and White is younger and better than them all. Can't find White's contract length but if the long term plan was for him to join either side in '24 then I think they and White would find an agreement.

[septic 9]

I think the SRU would find the funding for a year for White until they can balance the books at either club unless there is a club waiting in the wings to pick him up.

Price, Shiel and Steele are all out of contract next summer and White is younger and better than them all. Can't find White's contract length but if the long term plan was for him to join either side in '24 then I think they and White would find an agreement.

White has become a very fine player, but he has reached nowhere near the heights Price did in the 2 seasons leading up tohis Lions selection (before which he was already at or beyond the level White has reached). Price TBF has not been as good since that Lions tour and by his own admission form not his best last season, but he still has a much higher ceiling than White
I'd hope the SRU can find the money for White if LI go under and there is no other offer around, as I say a huge upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh but I just don't see space at Glasgow (or the need - budget needs to go on back 3 as a top priority)

[Big D]

I think the SRU would find the funding for a year for White until they can balance the books at either club unless there is a club waiting in the wings to pick him up.

Price, Shiel and Steele are all out of contract next summer and White is younger and better than them all. Can't find White's contract length but if the long term plan was for him to join either side in '24 then I think they and White would find an agreement.

White has become a very fine player, but he has reached nowhere near the heights Price did in the 2 seasons leading up tohis Lions selection (before which he was already at or beyond the level White has reached). Price TBF has not been as good since that Lions tour and by his own admission form not his best last season, but he still has a much higher ceiling than White
I'd hope the SRU can find the money for White if LI go under and there is no other offer around, as I say a huge upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh but I just don't see space at Glasgow (or the need - budget needs to go on back 3 as a top priority)

Price pre Lions was a far better player than Scotland have had at 9 for many years. But that was two years ago and although he held onto the national 9 shirt for a spell his form has been nowhere close to his pre Lions form. White is currently the best SQ 9, it really isn't that outlandish a statement.

The SRU will have been discussing whether or not they wanted to bring White north at the end of his contract before now. It is clear the likely scenario is Edinburgh would get the upgrade at 9 but included Price for completeness as he is OOC. His contract was signed at peak value post Lions so there will be a good saving to be made if his performances were to remain similar or worse and either party decide to move on


If the plan was to bring White north next year then the SRU will likely find the money for an additional season. They may have no interest in bringing him north of course.

[switchskier]

I think the SRU would find the funding for a year for White until they can balance the books at either club unless there is a club waiting in the wings to pick him up.

Price, Shiel and Steele are all out of contract next summer and White is younger and better than them all. Can't find White's contract length but if the long term plan was for him to join either side in '24 then I think they and White would find an agreement.

White has become a very fine player, but he has reached nowhere near the heights Price did in the 2 seasons leading up tohis Lions selection (before which he was already at or beyond the level White has reached). Price TBF has not been as good since that Lions tour and by his own admission form not his best last season, but he still has a much higher ceiling than White
I'd hope the SRU can find the money for White if LI go under and there is no other offer around, as I say a huge upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh but I just don't see space at Glasgow (or the need - budget needs to go on back 3 as a top priority)

Price pre Lions was a far better player than Scotland have had at 9 for many years. But that was two years ago and although he held onto the national 9 shirt for a spell his form has been nowhere close to his pre Lions form. White is currently the best SQ 9, it really isn't that outlandish a statement.

The SRU will have been discussing whether or not they wanted to bring White north at the end of his contract before now. It is clear the likely scenario is Edinburgh would get the upgrade at 9 but included Price for completeness as he is OOC. His contract was signed at peak value post Lions so there will be a good saving to be made if his performances were to remain similar or worse and either party decide to move on


If the plan was to bring White north next year then the SRU will likely find the money for an additional season. They may have no interest in bringing him north of course.

I was shocked to discover that Charlie Shiel is now 25 (and indeed 5 months older than White). He's shown glimpses but hasn't ever convinced a coach that he should get an extended run, despite all of the positive noises that cockers made. Hate to be harsh, but keeping him around as third choice suggests conservative, safe thinking. Surely there's an academy product out there that can push on and would benefit from getting a few minutes and training in that environment.

Hope that I'm wrong and a new coach provides the opportunity that he needs. But if not it feels like we're spinning our wheels.

[Mikey Brown]

White has become a very fine player, but he has reached nowhere near the heights Price did in the 2 seasons leading up tohis Lions selection (before which he was already at or beyond the level White has reached). Price TBF has not been as good since that Lions tour and by his own admission form not his best last season, but he still has a much higher ceiling than White
I'd hope the SRU can find the money for White if LI go under and there is no other offer around, as I say a huge upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh but I just don't see space at Glasgow (or the need - budget needs to go on back 3 as a top priority)

Price pre Lions was a far better player than Scotland have had at 9 for many years. But that was two years ago and although he held onto the national 9 shirt for a spell his form has been nowhere close to his pre Lions form. White is currently the best SQ 9, it really isn't that outlandish a statement.

The SRU will have been discussing whether or not they wanted to bring White north at the end of his contract before now. It is clear the likely scenario is Edinburgh would get the upgrade at 9 but included Price for completeness as he is OOC. His contract was signed at peak value post Lions so there will be a good saving to be made if his performances were to remain similar or worse and either party decide to move on


If the plan was to bring White north next year then the SRU will likely find the money for an additional season. They may have no interest in bringing him north of course.

I was shocked to discover that Charlie Shiel is now 25 (and indeed 5 months older than White). He's shown glimpses but hasn't ever convinced a coach that he should get an extended run, despite all of the positive noises that cockers made. Hate to be harsh, but keeping him around as third choice suggests conservative, safe thinking. Surely there's an academy product out there that can push on and would benefit from getting a few minutes and training in that environment.

Hope that I'm wrong and a new coach provides the opportunity that he needs. But if not it feels like we're spinning our wheels.

Equally he’s at that stage that maybe moving to a new environment might bring something out of him. He seems very talented, but agree he never seems to demand a spot.

[septic 9]

White has become a very fine player, but he has reached nowhere near the heights Price did in the 2 seasons leading up tohis Lions selection (before which he was already at or beyond the level White has reached). Price TBF has not been as good since that Lions tour and by his own admission form not his best last season, but he still has a much higher ceiling than White
I'd hope the SRU can find the money for White if LI go under and there is no other offer around, as I say a huge upgrade on anyone at Edinburgh but I just don't see space at Glasgow (or the need - budget needs to go on back 3 as a top priority)

Price pre Lions was a far better player than Scotland have had at 9 for many years. But that was two years ago and although he held onto the national 9 shirt for a spell his form has been nowhere close to his pre Lions form. White is currently the best SQ 9, it really isn't that outlandish a statement.

The SRU will have been discussing whether or not they wanted to bring White north at the end of his contract before now. It is clear the likely scenario is Edinburgh would get the upgrade at 9 but included Price for completeness as he is OOC. His contract was signed at peak value post Lions so there will be a good saving to be made if his performances were to remain similar or worse and either party decide to move on


If the plan was to bring White north next year then the SRU will likely find the money for an additional season. They may have no interest in bringing him north of course.

I was shocked to discover that Charlie Shiel is now 25 (and indeed 5 months older than White). He's shown glimpses but hasn't ever convinced a coach that he should get an extended run, despite all of the positive noises that cockers made. Hate to be harsh, but keeping him around as third choice suggests conservative, safe thinking. Surely there's an academy product out there that can push on and would benefit from getting a few minutes and training in that environment.

Hope that I'm wrong and a new coach provides the opportunity that he needs. But if not it feels like we're spinning our wheels.

Edinburgh's wheels have been spinning at half back for a decade and more. You are right about Shiel, he simply has never convinced a coach he is good enough to get a run. Not even really a mixed starter/bench run. He is 3rd choice again (Steel replacing Pyrgos to fight it out with the hugely over hyped Vellacott for a starting place). Problem is that a 3rd choice 9 should/can expect quite a lot of game time. One injury away. If Edinburgh had a clue about recruiting and developing half backs, a 3rd choice 9 would expect even more game time as one of the other 9s would regularly be away with Scotland
They haven't had a decent 9 since Laidlaw (who offered a very good if limited game) or a decent 10 since way before that

[BaldiePete]

Finn took a nasty one direct to the head yesterday. Kremer red carded, Finn off for an HIA which he passed and came back on. Unfortunately Racing won so he’ll have at least one more game. I was hoping they would lose so he could be wrapped in cotton wool before the RWC.

[Cameo]

Kremer is a dirtbag. He does this kind of thing far too often. Glad Finn is okay.

[francoisfou]

Just read that Sam Johnson has signed for Brive, who’ve just been relegated to ProD2. A good signing for Brive?

[switchskier]

Just read that Sam Johnson has signed for Brive, who’ve just been relegated to ProD2. A good signing for Brive?

He might be on the second half of his career but feels a good move for Brive as he's a solid all-round player that never relied on outstanding physical gifts to make his presence felt. A bit disappointed from a Scotland perspective though that he's not going to be playing at a higher level as he's still in the mix for me for 5th choice centre and it wouldn't take that many injuries.

I see that Craig has been let go by Gloucester. Sad that he's never seemed to kick on.

[Mikey Brown]

I love the way he plays and the attitude he brings. It’s a shame to see him go and he suffered from being in a very one-paced midfield towards the end for Scotland. But I think he’s reasonably behind Tuipulotu, Jones, Redpath, Harris, McDowell and Bennet at this point, no?

[switchskier]

I love the way he plays and the attitude he brings. It’s a shame to see him go and he suffered from being in a very one-paced midfield towards the end for Scotland. But I think he’s reasonably behind Tuipulotu, Jones, Redpath, Harris, McDowell and Bennet at this point, no?

I had the first four in mind (and personally Matt Scott has always been one of my guys, though I appreciate that ship has sailed) but I'd have him level with the other two currently. Certainly ahead of Lang, Dean, Scott or Currie (though I remain hopeful there of a breakout season).

[septic 9]

I love the way he plays and the attitude he brings. It’s a shame to see him go and he suffered from being in a very one-paced midfield towards the end for Scotland. But I think he’s reasonably behind Tuipulotu, Jones, Redpath, Harris, McDowell and Bennet at this point, no?

I had the first four in mind (and personally Matt Scott has always been one of my guys, though I appreciate that ship has sailed) but I'd have him level with the other two currently. Certainly ahead of Lang, Dean, Scott or Currie (though I remain hopeful there of a breakout season).

Johnson is an out and out 12, which kinda counts against him in terms of RWC squads, so its wrong to put him behind eg Bennett or Harris and Jones. Of course its just wrong to put any of them behind Harris

Can't see him making this RWC, but still a very good player and an excellent signing for Brive

[francoisfou]

Interesting comments, thanks!
I hope Brive have an excellent season 2023/24 and jump straight back into the Top14. They're a side whose results I have followed since their magnificent European Champions' title in 1997. However, the competition in ProD2 will be tough and a lot will depend on who else they can recruit before pre-season training begins.

[septic 9]

Interesting comments, thanks!
I hope Brive have an excellent season 2023/24 and jump straight back into the Top14. They're a side whose results I have followed since their magnificent European Champions' title in 1997. However, the competition in ProD2 will be tough and a lot will depend on who else they can recruit before pre-season training begins.

good luck to them, couple of ex Edinburgh in their squad.

Also I see they have signed Moriarty and already have Papali'i. How do they get on playing with 14 men?

[francoisfou]

Papa has left Brive for Castres where he'll join up with coach Jeremy Davidson who was sacked by Brive earlier in the season.

[Cameo]

Ben White apparently on his way to Toulon after the World Cup.

[Mikey Brown]

Surprising move in a way, but good for him. Edinburgh are in a weird spot and Glasgow already have too many 9s pushing for Scotland places.

[septic 9]

Ben White apparently on his way to Toulon after the World Cup.

SRU slip up or just money talking? Or both

Should have been signed for Edinburgh, he will be bench warming most of the time if he signs for Toulon, Serin has been absolutely outstanding this season

Anyway he has a job, in a nice place. Good luck to him

[septic 9]

Alex Craig released by Gloucs. Had a couple of horrendous seasons with injuries.
Good news is he has picked up a club - Scarlets