Cricket fred

[Digby]

Well played the Windies, easily the better side. Okay we had the worst of the batting conditions but given that was explicitly our choice it's not much of a defence.

The bowling was okay, not wonderful, but okay. Neither the seam attack nor the spin options were consistent, probably we rotate Broad in just to manage the workload on the bowlers but the bowling wasn't the problem.

The batting was business as usual, and therein lies a problem. Denly looks gone for all money, that might not be enough but it might also be all there is.

Nice to see the umpires struggle too with a return to cricket, I hope they get the chance and have better games than this

[Puja]

I think the main thing is that we've learned Stokes isn't ready for the captaincy. Batting first was universally recognised as a mistake in the conditions (and doubly so with everyone very ring-rusty), but was compounded by underbowling Bess on the final day, which was the main reward for batting first! I don't think he used himself as a bowler well enough either.

Puja

[fivepointer]

Tbf to Stokes, i think he expected the pitch to deteriorate a bit thus bringing Bess more into the game on the final day. As it turned out the pitch played pretty much the same throughout.
Its really the batsmen who have to hold their hands up for this defeat. 204 was a poor 1st innings and far too many batsmen got in, looked quite secure and then got themselves out in a lame brained way.
Denly will go and Buttler must be on some sort of final warning, surely.

[Stom]

I’d love to see Foakes get his chance but if it’s between Buttler and Barstow, I know which one I choose, and he’s not a red head.

I’m more concerned with Sibley. He’s not looked like the great accumulator... hope he comes good, though you could always move Crawley up and Pope will eventually be #3.

[Banquo]

eedjit
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/53419676

The attack could look very anaemic without him, Wood and Anderson; the pitch will also likely suit the quicker bowlers.

In fact, they have their strategy arse about face so far on bowling in this series. Also, leaving out Anderson at Old Trafford seems a tad odd.

[Banquo]

I’d love to see Foakes get his chance but if it’s between Buttler and Barstow, I know which one I choose, and he’s not a red head.

I’m more concerned with Sibley. He’s not looked like the great accumulator... hope he comes good, though you could always move Crawley up and Pope will eventually be #3.

Our batting is a tad shunt it has to be said.

[Stom]

I’d love to see Foakes get his chance but if it’s between Buttler and Barstow, I know which one I choose, and he’s not a red head.

I’m more concerned with Sibley. He’s not looked like the great accumulator... hope he comes good, though you could always move Crawley up and Pope will eventually be #3.

Our batting is a tad shunt it has to be said.

I’d say it’s not too bad now, just a little green in places and without root a little shunt.

Pope, Crawley and Sibley are all newcomers, Stokes has started to put together some more consistent scores, Burns is OK, just leaves the wk, where Buttler is out of sorts, YJB isn’t as good as he thinks he is and Foakes is overlooked

[Banquo]

I’d love to see Foakes get his chance but if it’s between Buttler and Barstow, I know which one I choose, and he’s not a red head.

I’m more concerned with Sibley. He’s not looked like the great accumulator... hope he comes good, though you could always move Crawley up and Pope will eventually be #3.

Our batting is a tad shunt it has to be said.

I’d say it’s not too bad now, just a little green in places and without root a little shunt.

Pope, Crawley and Sibley are all newcomers, Stokes has started to put together some more consistent scores, Burns is OK, just leaves the wk, where Buttler is out of sorts, YJB isn’t as good as he thinks he is and Foakes is overlooked

Burns is ok, but barely averaging 34 despite being 'settled'; Sibley has had 7 starts and starts not to look the part (you expressed concern yourself); Crawley is new, and looks promising ( 5 tests at 31...) ; Root has batted poorly in the last year, and captaincy and runs look like they are incompatible; Stokes is a quality six or seven, and pulls of some remarkable innings, but still only averages 37, which is low for a 5; Pope looks good I grant you (but averages 41). The lower order still is collapso city, even when stickimng Woakes and Curran in. Fag paper between being a tad shunt (and even there, that's about collective failure rather than individuals- it was bad in the first innings and collective failed from 5-11 in the second) and 'not too bad. (based on potential rather than actual) imo.

[Banquo]

batting going to get a good test here- put in, and its 'clammy'

[Banquo]

lol...

You can't argue with today's decision by West Indies. It's as gloomy as childhood camping trip to the Lake District

[Stom]

Well, in a round score way I got my wish with archer missing out, lol. Stupid.

[Banquo]

Well, in a round score way I got my wish with archer missing out, lol. Stupid.

Given how well he bowled iin the second innings, and given what we have ended up with I'd have wanted him, we could be very pop gun if this track is as flat as they are saying at the mo.

[Banquo]

FFS

[Banquo]

Turning like a turny thing but they are soft wickets.

[Digby]

I was about to say something nice

[Banquo]

I was about to say something nice

....as I said, a tad shunt. All three uber soft dismissals.

[Digby]

I was about to say something nice

....as I said, a tad shunt. All three uber soft dismissals.

Not as bad as that review for Chase's first. The mistake is one thing, but that was shocking judgement from both openers after the fact

[Puja]

Roston Chase is apparently the best spin bowler in the world. Or our batsmen have terrible mindsets, holes in their techniques, and keep losing concentration and making ridiculous mistakes - one or the other. Sibley's made an okay score, but considering how many lives he's had so far, I don't know he should be too proud of it.

Puja

[Banquo]

Roston Chase is apparently the best spin bowler in the world. Or our batsmen have terrible mindsets, holes in their techniques, and keep losing concentration and making ridiculous mistakes - one or the other. Sibley's made an okay score, but considering how many lives he's had so far, I don't know he should be too proud of it.

Puja

indeed. Though I'll credit Sibley for hanging in, its a good sign to keep scoring when you are playing poorly. Other players should take note. If Gabriel is crocked it should get easier after 60 or so overs as they tire.

[Puja]

Sibley dropped again! He's got to get a decent hundred here after this many lives - anything less would be rude.

Puja

[Banquo]

Sibley dropped again! He's got to get a decent hundred here after this many lives - anything less would be rude.

Puja

Good work from these two, having watched a bit more since tea, its not been easy.

[Digby]

Sibley only really offered the one drop I saw, there were some edges through/short of the slip with the bad one that Holder just didn't seem to pick up, and at best a half chance to short leg that didn't stick. It'd be tough to bat in Manchester when the ball swings a little and seams and spins without a little luck. On balance that's a decent effort, and he's meeting the ball much better than he used to.

Be interesting to see him up against bowlers going around or a left armer in another game, and he needs some scoring shots through the off side, but there's progress

[Puja]

Sibley only really offered the one drop I saw, there were some edges through/short of the slip with the bad one that Holder just didn't seem to pick up, and at best a half chance to short leg that didn't stick. It'd be tough to bat in Manchester when the ball swings a little and seams and spins without a little luck. On balance that's a decent effort, and he's meeting the ball much better than he used to.

Be interesting to see him up against bowlers going around or a left armer in another game, and he needs some scoring shots through the off side, but there's progress

I'd call the one to short-leg more than a half-chance - I'd say that sticks for about 6-7 times out of 10 and, really, giving that chance off Roston bloody Chase?! Plus there were a few play and misses where it was sheer luck that he didn't connect. I mean, you always need a bit of a luck, but he's had a *lot* this innings. Mind, he has made a good fist of it aside from those and hopefully this will be become big innings that he'll build his confidence around.

I can't believe people are criticising his style of play though. This is test cricket and he is a test opener. His job is the dull aggregation of runs and taking up miles in the fast bowler's legs. People sat and complained about Roy unleashing a few nice drives and getting out, and now they're sitting and complaining because an opener is occupying the crease and building a score? Get real.

Who's willing to bet that we go from 207/3 to 252 all out tomorrow morning though? This is a classic England collapse set-up, right here. Stokes goes second ball, Sibley follows suit 3 overs later and we end up 220/8 before the tail wags enough to take us over 250.

Puja

[Digby]

He hit that ball into shortleg and it went into the lads jumper at the waist. Unless that ball happens to fly into your hands you're never getting your hands to it, and then you're hoping it catches in your clothing. It might have stuck, but I wouldn't as a fielder think I'd put a chance down.

[Stom]

Sibley only really offered the one drop I saw, there were some edges through/short of the slip with the bad one that Holder just didn't seem to pick up, and at best a half chance to short leg that didn't stick. It'd be tough to bat in Manchester when the ball swings a little and seams and spins without a little luck. On balance that's a decent effort, and he's meeting the ball much better than he used to.

Be interesting to see him up against bowlers going around or a left armer in another game, and he needs some scoring shots through the off side, but there's progress

I'd call the one to short-leg more than a half-chance - I'd say that sticks for about 6-7 times out of 10 and, really, giving that chance off Roston bloody Chase?! Plus there were a few play and misses where it was sheer luck that he didn't connect. I mean, you always need a bit of a luck, but he's had a *lot* this innings. Mind, he has made a good fist of it aside from those and hopefully this will be become big innings that he'll build his confidence around.

I can't believe people are criticising his style of play though. This is test cricket and he is a test opener. His job is the dull aggregation of runs and taking up miles in the fast bowler's legs. People sat and complained about Roy unleashing a few nice drives and getting out, and now they're sitting and complaining because an opener is occupying the crease and building a score? Get real.

Who's willing to bet that we go from 207/3 to 252 all out tomorrow morning though? This is a classic England collapse set-up, right here. Stokes goes second ball, Sibley follows suit 3 overs later and we end up 220/8 before the tail wags enough to take us over 250.

Puja

Because Cook or Strauss could play shots as well as stick around. Not a lot of shots but more than just a flick off the pads.

I like the look of Crawley, he’s allowed a couple of blips like today, let’s see how he gets on with it.