2ND. TEST

[Galfon]

Sat 26 Jul, 11.00 am
Any changes expected by Faz ?

2nd & back-row of pack went well and will be expected to be unchanged, injuries allowing.

Half-backs and mid-field likewise.

Front row will still be his first-picks but whether he considers any of Genge/Sheehan/Furlong with ROG idea of 'finishers' to counter any potential late fold.

Back 3 and bench gives him numerous reasonable options for
changes with Morgan, George, Cummings, Pollock, White, Kinghorn all showing well In recent matches

He'll want no repeat of the 2nd. half accuracy and intensity drop-off that happened last week. Oz will think a few breaks their way
early on this time and it's game on.

[Donny osmond]

I'll be amazed for a number of reasons if he changes the starting line up, with the possible exception of the wings, but even then I think Farrell is the sort of coach who knows how good his players are and is willing to give them a chance to redeem their poor display from t1.

Bench spots might be a different story.

Edit: there's is a deeply cynical part of me that thinks he will swap out the centre partnership. I'm hoping that's just my mad Scottish persecution complex being unreasonable, but until the team is announced that internal voice isn't going to be quiet.

[Mikey Brown]

Edit: there's is a deeply cynical part of me that thinks he will swap out the centre partnership. I'm hoping that's just my mad Scottish persecution complex being unreasonable, but until the team is announced that internal voice isn't going to be quiet.

Ha. I hear you on that.

I was also gutted to realise Kinghorn threw that second interception as well. Not quite the day he’d have hoped for to push himself into the test side, particularly with (the generally wonderful) Keenan still looking a bit off colour.

Then I thought “hang on, performances in warmups don’t matter anyway, so who cares?” but I don’t feel the pedigree/credit/TMA argument applies to any of the Scottish players.

[Puja]

Edit: there's is a deeply cynical part of me that thinks he will swap out the centre partnership. I'm hoping that's just my mad Scottish persecution complex being unreasonable, but until the team is announced that internal voice isn't going to be quiet.

I am also concerned about that, as Farrell learned at the knee of Gatland as a Lions coach, and might share his tendency to react to stilted performance by packing the team with his coached nation. I suspect that the plan for today's game was supposed to be to give Ringrose a little run-out off the bench, prove that he's fit and back up to speed, and then he could be parachuted into the starting lineup so that Farrell's Favourite Best Boy Bundee can play 12.

I don't know whether Graham's early injury which forced Ringrose to play 70 mins has scuppered that or not though.

Puja

[pjm1]

Yeah I think Ringrose playing almost a full game has done his and Aki’s chance in for test 2. And the lack of oomph from the back 3 means the poor show by the test wings and FB will be excused.

I was convinced that he would mix the back row starter combo a bit, although I know that view wasn’t shared by all (Donny ) - and the way he’s managed the selections in this match it feels like an Earl-for-Morgan swap on the bench at best. Which I still think is a missed opportunity.

Of course, the status of McCarthy is the other unknown and hope beyond hope he’s ok. Chessum isn’t any kind of like-for-like swap there so that would mean pushing Beirne into the row, just after he had a very decent performance at 6.

I think the bomb squad tactics in our props is smart but don’t reckon Faz will do it. Let’s see… not too long to wait now.

[Mikey Brown]

I would think Chessum plays tighthead lock more than Beirne, and regularly scrums there with Itoje, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much which one is 5/6.

[Donny osmond]

I would think Chessum plays tighthead lock more than Beirne, and regularly scrums there with Itoje, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much which one is 5/6.

Not that this shit is living in my head, but I woke up this morning wondering what would be the point of Beirne at 5 and Chrssum at 6? Sure each can do a good job in those positions, but they can do better jobs in their 'natural' positions, imo. Beirne showed how good of a 6 he is in t1.

[Banquo]

I would think Chessum plays tighthead lock more than Beirne, and regularly scrums there with Itoje, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much which one is 5/6.

Not that this shit is living in my head, but I woke up this morning wondering what would be the point of Beirne at 5 and Chrssum at 6? Sure each can do a good job in those positions, but they can do better jobs in their 'natural' positions, imo. Beirne showed how good of a 6 he is in t1.

Perzackly.

[Cameo]

I can't see much change.

If McCarthy is fit, I reckon the starting pack stays the same. I think Morgan may come in on the bench though. Personally I would start him despite Curry being decent last week. It's a bit of a funny one though as it doesn't feel right to have an out and out 7 on the bench when Earl offers a bit more cover. But if Curry is almost certainly going to need to come off then you might as well have your best option there. I would also have George on the bench, but don't think it's going to happen.

In the backs, Hansen may come in, but I am not sure that solves the lack of pace problem. Kinghorn would, but last night might convince Farrell it is a risk he doesn't need to take. He may just stick with what he had and hope they cut out the mistakes.

If McCarthy is out, I would start Chessum there and bring Cummings onto the bench, but suspect it would be Ryan on the bench.

[Banquo]

I can't see much change.

If McCarthy is fit, I reckon the starting pack stays the same. I think Morgan may come in on the bench though. Personally I would start him despite Curry being decent last week. It's a bit of a funny one though as it doesn't feel right to have an out and out 7 on the bench when Earl offers a bit more cover. But if Curry is almost certainly going to need to come off then you might as well have your best option there. I would also have George on the bench, but don't think it's going to happen.

In the backs, Hansen may come in, but I am not sure that solves the lack of pace problem. Kinghorn would, but last night might convince Farrell it is a risk he doesn't need to take. He may just stick with what he had and hope they cut out the mistakes.

If McCarthy is out, I would start Chessum there and bring Cummings onto the bench, but suspect it would be Ryan on the bench.

Ryan stank the place out on Tuesday. Cummings has been excellent but went the distance so you may be right,
Mccarthy would be a big loss.
I’d bring Kinghorn in for Keenan, but I can’t find a convincing back three from those available.
You just know Faz jr is benching

[pjm1]

I would think Chessum plays tighthead lock more than Beirne, and regularly scrums there with Itoje, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much which one is 5/6.

Not that this shit is living in my head, but I woke up this morning wondering what would be the point of Beirne at 5 and Chrssum at 6? Sure each can do a good job in those positions, but they can do better jobs in their 'natural' positions, imo. Beirne showed how good of a 6 he is in t1.

I agree he was very good at 6 in the last test. Curry got plaudits but I thought Beirne was better - and obviously played longer. Was gassed at the end but fair enough.

I don’t follow Ireland at all (other than when they’re playing England!) but gut feel Beirne plays more at lock (5) than blindside? I may well be wrong and happy to concede that.

Chessum I’m far more familiar with both at Tigers and the England outings. He is straight up and down a 5 as you say. My issue is that he is not an effective partner for Itoje if you want to play a power game. He is certainly no replacement for McCarthy in terms of style and strengths.

[Banquo]

I would think Chessum plays tighthead lock more than Beirne, and regularly scrums there with Itoje, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much which one is 5/6.

Not that this shit is living in my head, but I woke up this morning wondering what would be the point of Beirne at 5 and Chrssum at 6? Sure each can do a good job in those positions, but they can do better jobs in their 'natural' positions, imo. Beirne showed how good of a 6 he is in t1.

I agree he was very good at 6 in the last test. Curry got plaudits but I thought Beirne was better - and obviously played longer. Was gassed at the end but fair enough.

I don’t follow Ireland at all (other than when they’re playing England!) but gut feel Beirne plays more at lock (5) than blindside? I may well be wrong and happy to concede that.

Chessum I’m far more familiar with both at Tigers and the England outings. He is straight up and down a 5 as you say. My issue is that he is not an effective partner for Itoje if you want to play a power game. He is certainly no replacement for McCarthy in terms of style and strengths.

Yep. Beirne is a better 6 imo than lock, and fits with playing MCarthy well (mccarthy rarely used as a jumper). As before McCarthy would be a big loss.
Backrow/pack was excellent as a collective for 50, but dropped off a cliff when Genge, Sheehan, furlong, McCarthy and curry went off…Itoje and Beirne then fell away badly last 15 imo

[Which Tyler]

Quarter of his starts coming in the backrow seems a lot for someone who's "straight up and down a 5"
Which doesn't mean I think he's a BSF btw, just not a stranger to the position

[Danno]

With how much Itoje has been overplayed in the last season* it's amazing he can even walk

*more like 5 seasons

[Banquo]

With how much Itoje has been overplayed in the last season* it's amazing he can even walk

*more like 5 seasons

True and like all the pack a very intense 50 mins or so.

[pjm1]

Quarter of his starts coming in the backrow seems a lot for someone who's "straight up and down a 5"
Which doesn't mean I think he's a BSF btw, just not a stranger to the position

Now I’m confused

Which is easy…

I was advocating - if and only if McC is out - Beirne moving to 5 and Chessum to 6.

I feel Beirne is a better swap for McC than Chessum would be.

I then took the consensus here to my suggestion to be that this is the wrong way around and Chessum and 5 and Beirne at 6 is more sensible.

I know Chess is used far more at 5 both for Tigers and England. Against SA, France and where we want to play tighter AND get an extra l/o option I see the benefit of him playing 6 but otherwise I really do see him as a 5.

So I think we might be vehemently agreeing at playing Beirne at 5 and Chess at 6 is not crazy? Even though Chessum’s more natural position is 5?

[Which Tyler]

Sorry - think I was focusing on the "straight up and down a 5" bit, and glossing over the rest

[pjm1]

Sorry - think I was focusing on the "straight up and down a 5" bit, and glossing over the rest

To be fair, I think my posts can cause that “glossing over”

[Which Tyler]

TBF, my insomnia can cause of lot of glossing over of anyone's posts

[Spiffy]

I can't see much change.

If McCarthy is fit, I reckon the starting pack stays the same. I think Morgan may come in on the bench though. Personally I would start him despite Curry being decent last week. It's a bit of a funny one though as it doesn't feel right to have an out and out 7 on the bench when Earl offers a bit more cover. But if Curry is almost certainly going to need to come off then you might as well have your best option there. I would also have George on the bench, but don't think it's going to happen.

In the backs, Hansen may come in, but I am not sure that solves the lack of pace problem. Kinghorn would, but last night might convince Farrell it is a risk he doesn't need to take. He may just stick with what he had and hope they cut out the mistakes.

If McCarthy is out, I would start Chessum there and bring Cummings onto the bench, but suspect it would be Ryan on the bench.

Ryan stank the place out on Tuesday. Cummings has been excellent but went the distance so you may be right,
Mccarthy would be a big loss.
I’d bring Kinghorn in for Keenan, but I can’t find a convincing back three from those available.
You just know Faz jr is benching

Yes - Ryan is a total waste of space and never should have toured in the first place.
I would not bee too surprised if Keenan gets another chance to redeem himself and Kinghorn has a run on the wing over Lowe.
Would also not rule out the possibility of seeing Rigrose on the wing at some point. He has played well there for Leinster in the past and is a useful mdfield rover.
Much depends on Hansen's fitness. If he's fit he's probably in.

[switchskier]

Freeman and Kinghorn give you a lot of flexibility if they're in the 23. So it could be a 6/2 bench with an actual lock, an open side and a more versatile player to come on and give impetus when we tire, as happened in the first test.

[Banquo]

I can't see much change.

If McCarthy is fit, I reckon the starting pack stays the same. I think Morgan may come in on the bench though. Personally I would start him despite Curry being decent last week. It's a bit of a funny one though as it doesn't feel right to have an out and out 7 on the bench when Earl offers a bit more cover. But if Curry is almost certainly going to need to come off then you might as well have your best option there. I would also have George on the bench, but don't think it's going to happen.

In the backs, Hansen may come in, but I am not sure that solves the lack of pace problem. Kinghorn would, but last night might convince Farrell it is a risk he doesn't need to take. He may just stick with what he had and hope they cut out the mistakes.

If McCarthy is out, I would start Chessum there and bring Cummings onto the bench, but suspect it would be Ryan on the bench.

Ryan stank the place out on Tuesday. Cummings has been excellent but went the distance so you may be right,
Mccarthy would be a big loss.
I’d bring Kinghorn in for Keenan, but I can’t find a convincing back three from those available.
You just know Faz jr is benching

Yes - Ryan is a total waste of space and never should have toured in the first place.
I would not bee too surprised if Keenan gets another chance to redeem himself and Kinghorn has a run on the wing over Lowe.
Would also not rule out the possibility of seeing Rigrose on the wing at some point. He has played well there for Leinster in the past and is a useful mdfield rover.
Much depends on Hansen's fitness. If he's fit he's probably in.

Not sure why Hansen should be in tbh. What problem is he solving?

[Spiffy]

Ryan stank the place out on Tuesday. Cummings has been excellent but went the distance so you may be right,
Mccarthy would be a big loss.
I’d bring Kinghorn in for Keenan, but I can’t find a convincing back three from those available.
You just know Faz jr is benching

Yes - Ryan is a total waste of space and never should have toured in the first place.
I would not bee too surprised if Keenan gets another chance to redeem himself and Kinghorn has a run on the wing over Lowe.
Would also not rule out the possibility of seeing Rigrose on the wing at some point. He has played well there for Leinster in the past and is a useful mdfield rover.
Much depends on Hansen's fitness. If he's fit he's probably in.

Not sure why Hansen should be in tbh. What problem is he solving?

Invention/creativity/game reading/the unexpected? (But not pace). I would stick with Freeman but axe Lowe for Hansen. But I'd be happy enough with Keenan/Kinghorn/Freeman. Keenan has stuttered after his debilitating illness, but he's a great FB, and Farrell likes him.

[Mr Mwenda]

Team's up. Injury forces a change in the centres and brings junior to the bench.

At least Morgan will get a go.

15-Hugo Keenan, 14-Tommy Freeman, 13-Huw Jones, 12-Bundee Aki, 11-James Lowe, 10-Finn Russell, 9-Jamison Gibson-Park, 8-Jack Conan, 7-Tom Curry, 6-Tadhg Beirne, 5-Ollie Chessum, 4-Maro Itoje, 3-Tadhg Furlong, 2-Dan Sheehan, 1-Andrew Porter
Replacements: 16-Ronan Kelleher, 17-Ellis Genge, 18-Will Stuart, 19-James Ryan, 20-Jac Morgan, 21-Alex Mitchell, 22-Owen Farrell, 23-Blair Kinghorn

[Donny osmond]

Injury enforced changes at 5 and 12 i can understand.

Porter is one of those players that I just don't see what others see. Until he proves me wrong on Sat, and I hope he does, he's more a liability than an asset.

On the bench changes: I don't get what Ryan brings either, but he's Irish and as Puja said earlier, the coach is going to go with his favourites; Farrell jnr I don't like but understand given he covers 10 and 12, I would expect him to replace Aki early in the 2nd half in the normal run of things. If the pack are on top OF could have a decent game, if the pack are struggling like they did in t1, having him at 12 could backfire badly.