Autumn 2018 schedule

[fivepointer]

Eddie Jones’ side will play four Test matches in next season’s series at Twickenham Stadium against South Africa (3 November), New Zealand (10 November), Japan (17 November) and Australia (24 November).

All matches will be broadcast live on Sky Sports with kick off times to be confirmed at a later date.

England will host South Africa in the first match of the campaign following a three-Test series against the Springboks in June 2018.

England will then face the All Blacks for the first time in four years. In 2014 England lost four times to the All Blacks including a three-Test series in New Zealand and they last beat New Zealand in 2012, defeating the number one side in the world 38-21 at Twickenham.

The Test match against Japan (17 November) will be only the second time in history the two sides have played each other. The only previous meeting between the two nations was at the inaugural Rugby World Cup in 1987 when England secured a comfortable 60-7 victory over the Brave Blossoms in Sydney.

In the fourth Test of the autumn, England will face Australia who have lost their last four matches against Jones’ side.

[Scrumhead]

I'm very excited by the 2018 schedule. Easily the best set of fixtures we've had in some time.

We have 15 games plus any warm-up matches between now and the World-Cup so anyone as yet uncapped is not going to have much time to state their case.

[Mellsblue]

Yep. Nice looking set of fixtures.

[Digby]

What match fees will be paid to the various touring teams?

[Oakboy]

I'm very excited by the 2018 schedule. Easily the best set of fixtures we've had in some time.

We have 15 games plus any warm-up matches between now and the World-Cup so anyone as yet uncapped is not going to have much time to state their case.

Banquo keeps bollocking me for saying that.

[Puja]

What match fees will be paid to the various touring teams?

Depending on when the window starts, it'll be either the South Africa game or the Australia game that's outside of the window, so whichever of them it is will be the only one getting a match fee.

Puja

[Cameo]

I'm very excited by the 2018 schedule. Easily the best set of fixtures we've had in some time.

We have 15 games plus any warm-up matches between now and the World-Cup so anyone as yet uncapped is not going to have much time to state their case.

Banquo keeps bollocking me for saying that.

Im an outsider but can that be right? Surely you have three (or is it 4) games this autumn then 5 6N games in 2018 then a summer 2018 tour then these four and another 5 in the 2019 6N? That makes around 20 or am I missing something?

Anyway, Im not sure I buy the premise. Experience is handy but plenty of players have performed early in their careers. Just recently Rieko Ioune (sorry about the spelling) and Jordie Barrett did alright on debut. I'd say if someone is playing better than the incumbent, 5 caps is more than enough to become but a nailed on starter and less to deserve a place in the squad

[Mikey Brown]

I feel like we've just gotten used to it taking 50+ caps to get even a handful of decent performances out of some players. Not sure I need to name them.

[scuzzaman]

As a kiwi I'm very much looking forward to that game against England. It's a long time between drinks for someone thirsting to have a go at a decent pack with both strength and skill. The Aussies have been average in that dept for most of a decade if not longer, the Argentines have gone markedly backward and South Africa have been good but also their usual hot-n-cold, especially away from home.

Actually, i'd say this game is shaping up to be an arm-wrestle across the park. Exciting stuff.

[Banquo]

I'm very excited by the 2018 schedule. Easily the best set of fixtures we've had in some time.

We have 15 games plus any warm-up matches between now and the World-Cup so anyone as yet uncapped is not going to have much time to state their case.

Banquo keeps bollocking me for saying that.

quite rightly

[Scrumhead]

I'm very excited by the 2018 schedule. Easily the best set of fixtures we've had in some time.

We have 15 games plus any warm-up matches between now and the World-Cup so anyone as yet uncapped is not going to have much time to state their case.

Banquo keeps bollocking me for saying that.

Im an outsider but can that be right? Surely you have three (or is it 4) games this autumn then 5 6N games in 2018 then a summer 2018 tour then these four and another 5 in the 2019 6N? That makes around 20 or am I missing something?

Anyway, Im not sure I buy the premise. Experience is handy but plenty of players have performed early in their careers. Just recently Rieko Ioune (sorry about the spelling) and Jordie Barrett did alright on debut. I'd say if someone is playing better than the incumbent, 5 caps is more than enough to become but a nailed on starter and less to deserve a place in the squad

Not sure where 15 came from ... 20 is correct.

By my reckoning it's 3 AIs this year + 4 AIs next year + a 3 game tour of SA next summer and 5 games each in the 6 Nations for 2018 and 2019.

We'll most likely have a couple of warm-up games too.

I still think 20 games is not many when we have at least 2-3 positions with question-marks over who is most likely to occupy them in 2019 (7, 12 and 15 are most pressing IMO).

On the other hand, it's only taken 12 games (not all starts) for Itoje to establish himself as one of the first names on the team sheet. He is a bit of an outlier though.

[Banquo]

Banquo keeps bollocking me for saying that.

Im an outsider but can that be right? Surely you have three (or is it 4) games this autumn then 5 6N games in 2018 then a summer 2018 tour then these four and another 5 in the 2019 6N? That makes around 20 or am I missing something?

Anyway, Im not sure I buy the premise. Experience is handy but plenty of players have performed early in their careers. Just recently Rieko Ioune (sorry about the spelling) and Jordie Barrett did alright on debut. I'd say if someone is playing better than the incumbent, 5 caps is more than enough to become but a nailed on starter and less to deserve a place in the squad

Not sure where 15 came from ... 20 is correct.

By my reckoning it's 3 AIs this year + 4 AIs next year + a 3 game tour of SA next summer and 5 games each in the 6 Nations for 2018 and 2019.

We'll most likely have a couple of warm-up games too.

I still think 20 games is not many when we have at least 2-3 positions with question-marks over who is most likely to occupy them in 2019 (7, 12 and 15 are most pressing IMO).

On the other hand, it's only taken 12 games (not all starts) for Itoje to establish himself as one of the first names on the team sheet. He is a bit of an outlier though.

Whole back three has question marks, certainly in terms of who starts, in addition to those you have mentioned. I'd also add that Hartley and Robshaw (and indeed Cole) will be pretty long in the tooth by then, and both Robshaw and Cole have a lot of miles in their legs already.

...and if it were only 2-3 positions, I wouldn't be overly worried by the number of games- its who would fill the slots to improve the status quo.

[Scrumhead]

Perhaps - I guess it depends how you define a 'problem'. Robshaw is one of the fittest players in the squad and while he is one of our older players, I wouldn't regard 6 as a 'problem' position in particular as long as he is available. Wilson immediately impressed at test level and I would like to see Eddie give him some more game time with a view to developing as a high quality back-up to Robshaw.

As for Hartley, I think we're in a good position in that we have an excellent, test-ready successor in Jamie George as well as several good (if inexperienced) back-ups in Cowan-Dickie, Taylor and Dunn. The only real questions are when will George take over and will it be before the World Cup?

As for the wingers, I don't really see a problem. Yes, there is a legitimate question on what our best back three is, but we have four proven test-standard wingers in Watson, Daly, Nowell and May which is not a bad position to be in. Yarde and Solomona have also had good starts to the season so we have decent cover if needed.

[Banquo]

Perhaps - I guess it depends how you define a 'problem'. Robshaw is one of the fittest players in the squad and while he is one of our older players, I wouldn't regard 6 as a 'problem' position in particular as long as he is available. Wilson immediately impressed at test level and I would like to see Eddie give him some more game time with a view to developing as a high quality back-up to Robshaw.

As for Hartley, I think we're in a good position in that we have an excellent, test-ready successor in Jamie George as well as several good (if inexperienced) back-ups in Cowan-Dickie, Taylor and Dunn. The only real questions are when will George take over and will it be before the World Cup?

As for the wingers, I don't really see a problem. Yes, there is a legitimate question on what our best back three is, but we have four proven test-standard wingers in Watson, Daly, Nowell and May which is not a bad position to be in. Yarde and Solomona have also had good starts to the season so we have decent cover if needed.

I don't think I used the word problem..but anyway, Wilson 'impressed' against a second string Argentine side, and I'd be pleasnatly surprised if Robshaw got through to 2019 unscathed, and even then will be 33 come the RWC; assuming he will be up to it and fit is a big assumption.
You've summed up the problem at hooker nicely; we need to find a cogent back up plan for George, and again hope he doesn't get crocked.
My point about wingers is obviously a different one, but we are far from clear as to what our best combo is; and if Daly is test class on the wing (and I agree) he has established himself there in a not many games, so maybe Itoje isn't that much of an outlier...and even then I'm accepting your argument about the quality we are choosing from.

So- I think we have head scratchers in more than a couple of positions- without wven mentioning 9- but think we do have time to resolve them, as long as Eddie acknowledges them, and is prepared to bite the bullet to improve the status quo as per my last comment.

[Stom]

Perhaps - I guess it depends how you define a 'problem'. Robshaw is one of the fittest players in the squad and while he is one of our older players, I wouldn't regard 6 as a 'problem' position in particular as long as he is available. Wilson immediately impressed at test level and I would like to see Eddie give him some more game time with a view to developing as a high quality back-up to Robshaw.

As for Hartley, I think we're in a good position in that we have an excellent, test-ready successor in Jamie George as well as several good (if inexperienced) back-ups in Cowan-Dickie, Taylor and Dunn. The only real questions are when will George take over and will it be before the World Cup?

As for the wingers, I don't really see a problem. Yes, there is a legitimate question on what our best back three is, but we have four proven test-standard wingers in Watson, Daly, Nowell and May which is not a bad position to be in. Yarde and Solomona have also had good starts to the season so we have decent cover if needed.

I don't think I used the word problem..but anyway, Wilson 'impressed' against a second string Argentine side, and I'd be pleasnatly surprised if Robshaw got through to 2019 unscathed, and even then will be 33 come the RWC; assuming he will be up to it and fit is a big assumption.
You've summed up the problem at hooker nicely; we need to find a cogent back up plan for George, and again hope he doesn't get crocked.
My point about wingers is obviously a different one, but we are far from clear as to what our best combo is; and if Daly is test class on the wing (and I agree) he has established himself there in a not many games, so maybe Itoje isn't that much of an outlier...and even then I'm accepting your argument about the quality we are choosing from.

So- I think we have head scratchers in more than a couple of positions- without wven mentioning 9- but think we do have time to resolve them, as long as Eddie acknowledges them, and is prepared to bite the bullet to improve the status quo as per my last comment.

2015 WC Winners NZ - Mealamu, McCaw, Woodcock, Smith, Carter, Nonu all 33+ at start of WC.
2011 WC Winners NZ - Thorn 33+ at start of WC.
2007 WC Winners SA - du Randt, van den Berg, Montgomery all 33+ at start of WC.
2003 WC Winners England - West, Leonard, Back, Johnson all 33+ at start of WC.
1999 WC Winners Australia - Strauss, Crowley 33+ at start of WC.

So you can prosper in a World Cup past your 33rd birthday. And Robshaw is A) extremely fit and B) has never relied on his speed of movement.

[Banquo]

Perhaps - I guess it depends how you define a 'problem'. Robshaw is one of the fittest players in the squad and while he is one of our older players, I wouldn't regard 6 as a 'problem' position in particular as long as he is available. Wilson immediately impressed at test level and I would like to see Eddie give him some more game time with a view to developing as a high quality back-up to Robshaw.

As for Hartley, I think we're in a good position in that we have an excellent, test-ready successor in Jamie George as well as several good (if inexperienced) back-ups in Cowan-Dickie, Taylor and Dunn. The only real questions are when will George take over and will it be before the World Cup?

As for the wingers, I don't really see a problem. Yes, there is a legitimate question on what our best back three is, but we have four proven test-standard wingers in Watson, Daly, Nowell and May which is not a bad position to be in. Yarde and Solomona have also had good starts to the season so we have decent cover if needed.

I don't think I used the word problem..but anyway, Wilson 'impressed' against a second string Argentine side, and I'd be pleasnatly surprised if Robshaw got through to 2019 unscathed, and even then will be 33 come the RWC; assuming he will be up to it and fit is a big assumption.
You've summed up the problem at hooker nicely; we need to find a cogent back up plan for George, and again hope he doesn't get crocked.
My point about wingers is obviously a different one, but we are far from clear as to what our best combo is; and if Daly is test class on the wing (and I agree) he has established himself there in a not many games, so maybe Itoje isn't that much of an outlier...and even then I'm accepting your argument about the quality we are choosing from.

So- I think we have head scratchers in more than a couple of positions- without wven mentioning 9- but think we do have time to resolve them, as long as Eddie acknowledges them, and is prepared to bite the bullet to improve the status quo as per my last comment.

2015 WC Winners NZ - Mealamu, McCaw, Woodcock, Smith, Carter, Nonu all 33+ at start of WC.
2011 WC Winners NZ - Thorn 33+ at start of WC.
2007 WC Winners SA - du Randt, van den Berg, Montgomery all 33+ at start of WC.
2003 WC Winners England - West, Leonard, Back, Johnson all 33+ at start of WC.
1999 WC Winners Australia - Strauss, Crowley 33+ at start of WC.

So you can prosper in a World Cup past your 33rd birthday. And Robshaw is A) extremely fit and B) has never relied on his speed of movement.

....not ruling him out, but has to be considered, no? Its hardly a controversial point I'm making- and it even assumes Robshaw will still be worth his place then.

Also, if you look at the more recent examples on your list, consider the miles in their legs/minutes played, vs Robshaw's mileage. The earlier ones are kind of irrelevent given how much harder the game has become.

[Oakboy]

Eddie's various comments over a period of time indicate that his squad is fairly settled unless somebody else comes along and demands to be selected (presumably with constant, outstanding club performances). Bearing in mind that George appears not yet to be guaranteed a starting slot ahead of Hartley and using that as a criterion, who else is there in the queue?

We have good injury cover in most positions but that's about it as things stand. I think we have 30-40 players of reasonable standard, a better position than many rival countries, but I think we are looking at more or less the same XV/XXIII that played in the last 6N through to the RWC apart from the odd injury/form shuffle.

[Stom]

Eddie's various comments over a period of time indicate that his squad is fairly settled unless somebody else comes along and demands to be selected (presumably with constant, outstanding club performances). Bearing in mind that George appears not yet to be guaranteed a starting slot ahead of Hartley and using that as a criterion, who else is there in the queue?

We have good injury cover in most positions but that's about it as things stand. I think we have 30-40 players of reasonable standard, a better position than many rival countries, but I think we are looking at more or less the same XV/XXIII that played in the last 6N through to the RWC apart from the odd injury/form shuffle.

We're strong in depth, but the problem is the top quality to fill up some spots in the 23.

I'm sure many teams would be delighted with Roko and Yarde and Solomona as 4th/5th/6th/7th choice wings, while I'm sure Aus would love Collier as 1st or 2nd choice TH, never mind 4th or 5th!

Or the fact Genge is our 3rd choice LH, Launch can't get into the 15, and we've got 13s crawling out of our arse.

But we cannot find a top class player for 7, 9, 12 or 15 (Watson perhaps, let's see).

[Mellsblue]

Eddie's various comments over a period of time indicate that his squad is fairly settled unless somebody else comes along and demands to be selected (presumably with constant, outstanding club performances). Bearing in mind that George appears not yet to be guaranteed a starting slot ahead of Hartley and using that as a criterion, who else is there in the queue?

We have good injury cover in most positions but that's about it as things stand. I think we have 30-40 players of reasonable standard, a better position than many rival countries, but I think we are looking at more or less the same XV/XXIII that played in the last 6N through to the RWC apart from the odd injury/form shuffle.

We're strong in depth, but the problem is the top quality to fill up some spots in the 23.

I'm sure many teams would be delighted with Roko and Yarde and Solomona as 4th/5th/6th/7th choice wings, while I'm sure Aus would love Collier as 1st or 2nd choice TH, never mind 4th or 5th!

Or the fact Genge is our 3rd choice LH, Launch can't get into the 15, and we've got 13s crawling out of our arse.

But we cannot find a top class player for 7, 9, 12 or 15 (Watson perhaps, let's see).

I'd add 11 and 14 to that list. All the wingers, if Watson goes to 15, are seriously flawed in some way.

[Banquo]

Eddie's various comments over a period of time indicate that his squad is fairly settled unless somebody else comes along and demands to be selected (presumably with constant, outstanding club performances). Bearing in mind that George appears not yet to be guaranteed a starting slot ahead of Hartley and using that as a criterion, who else is there in the queue?

We have good injury cover in most positions but that's about it as things stand. I think we have 30-40 players of reasonable standard, a better position than many rival countries, but I think we are looking at more or less the same XV/XXIII that played in the last 6N through to the RWC apart from the odd injury/form shuffle.

We're strong in depth, but the problem is the top quality to fill up some spots in the 23.

I'm sure many teams would be delighted with Roko and Yarde and Solomona as 4th/5th/6th/7th choice wings, while I'm sure Aus would love Collier as 1st or 2nd choice TH, never mind 4th or 5th!

Or the fact Genge is our 3rd choice LH, Launch can't get into the 15, and we've got 13s crawling out of our arse.

But we cannot find a top class player for 7, 9, 12 or 15 (Watson perhaps, let's see).

I'd add 11 and 14 to that list. All the wingers, if Watson goes to 15, are seriously flawed in some way.

indeed. Our prop and lock supply looks good, and good quality; hooker, back row, 9, midfield, back three all have issues for me (depth and quality). As I've said before, need upgrades in every unit, bar lock.

[Digby]

Eddie's various comments over a period of time indicate that his squad is fairly settled unless somebody else comes along and demands to be selected (presumably with constant, outstanding club performances). Bearing in mind that George appears not yet to be guaranteed a starting slot ahead of Hartley and using that as a criterion, who else is there in the queue?

We have good injury cover in most positions but that's about it as things stand. I think we have 30-40 players of reasonable standard, a better position than many rival countries, but I think we are looking at more or less the same XV/XXIII that played in the last 6N through to the RWC apart from the odd injury/form shuffle.

We're strong in depth, but the problem is the top quality to fill up some spots in the 23.

I'm sure many teams would be delighted with Roko and Yarde and Solomona as 4th/5th/6th/7th choice wings, while I'm sure Aus would love Collier as 1st or 2nd choice TH, never mind 4th or 5th!

Or the fact Genge is our 3rd choice LH, Launch can't get into the 15, and we've got 13s crawling out of our arse.

But we cannot find a top class player for 7, 9, 12 or 15 (Watson perhaps, let's see).

I'd add 11 and 14 to that list. All the wingers, if Watson goes to 15, are seriously flawed in some way.

I'd add 3 and 6 to the list too, and I wouldn't know what our selections or shape will be like with whoever is at 10 and 13 in a few months

[Scrumhead]

Honestly, if you knew nothing about English rugby, you would read this thread and come away thinking we are complete no-hopers.

I'm not ignorant to our deficiencies and I completely accept we're nowhere near the finished article but at the same time some of these comments are seriously harsh on our players.

As I see it, NZ are a class apart, but aside from the All Blacks, I wouldn't swap our squad for any other country's players. Our own results and those of the other countries we're competing with suggest we're rightly 2nd in the world right now.

You would not think that looking at this thread!

[fivepointer]

I think we're in a good place generally and do seem to to be building enviable depth in a number of positions.

But its the issues at 7, 9 and 12 that have been long outstanding and show little sign of immediate resolution that drives a degree of caution.

[Banquo]

Honestly, if you knew nothing about this board, you would read this thread and come away thinking that there are a few folks not content with 'being in a good place' or being (perhaps) only second best to New Zealand, that they might not be content with deficiencies that are obvious, and in not looking to improve across the board, and striving to be the best in the world.

We all agree that 20% of a starting 15 needs immediate improvement; I have the temerity to suggest that we could do with improving at least 3 or 4 more, and have a plan around 2,6, and back 3. Frankly, I don't think that's harsh, and if the coaches aren't looking for continual improvement (with existing and new players) they aren't doing their job. If anything, I feel I've been restrained over the likes of Ben Youngs (as in I have only just mentioned his name!). I guess its just a difference in attitude towards developing a team.

[Oakboy]

Honestly, if you knew nothing about this board, you would read this thread and come away thinking that there are a few folks not content with 'being in a good place' or being (perhaps) only second best to New Zealand, that they might not be content with deficiencies that are obvious, and in not looking to improve across the board, and striving to be the best in the world.

We all agree that 20% of a starting 15 needs immediate improvement; I have the temerity to suggest that we could do with improving at least 3 or 4 more, and have a plan around 2,6, and back 3. Frankly, I don't think that's harsh, and if the coaches aren't looking for continual improvement (with existing and new players) they aren't doing their job. If anything, I feel I've been restrained over the likes of Ben Youngs (as in I have only just mentioned his name!). I guess its just a difference in attitude towards developing a team.

I agree with your development targets but I just don't think Eddie will find substantially better players in time for the RWC. I hope he does because I'd like to see us improve as a unit by at least the 10% necessary to challenge NZ. Maybe, he thinks the team can improve with the existing players.

Thinking back to the last 6N, there was room for improvement in quite a few individuals' performances. Itoje, JJ, Farrell, Ford and Youngs were all below their best, for example. Of course, one could argue that picking Itoje as a conventional lock sorts him out. JJ needs a different mix around him. Farrell is a make-shift IC. Ford needs something different either side of him etc. etc. Unless a new 7, 9 and 12 fall out of the sky, there will still be compromise and a lack of fluency.