England v Scotland, Saturday 4.45

[BaldiePete]

Price, McCann and Redpath called up for the match against England. Hopefully Price is nowhere near the match day squad, he’s been poor for Edinburgh (and I’m being charitable to say that). McCann will just be cover and holding tackle bags. Redpath is interesting though. He’s played well against England in the past and before Tuipolotu came on the scene he was seen as the 12 Scotland needed. Darcy wont be fit, so thinking of possibilities:

1. Redpath goes to 12 with Jordan dropping to the bench and Rowe on the wing
2. Redpath goes to 12, Jordan to 15 and Kinghorn on the wing.
3. Keep Jordan at 12, Kinghorn at 15 and put Rowe on the wing with Redpath on the bench.

However, this all assumes that Russell is fit to play. If not, then:

4. Jordan at 10, Redpath (or McDowell, but I think Townsend likes Redpath) at 12, Rowe on the wing and Kinghorn stays at 15.

I have zero confidence for this match. We’ve had the better of England since 2018 but I fear we’re heading back to the old days.

[BaldiePete]

According to The Offside Line Darcy might be fit for Saturday.

https://www.theoffsideline.com/6n-engla ... ad-update/

[Mikey Brown]

I really like Redpath but I thought McDowall was one of the few bright spots against Ireland.

Easy to say now but I feel Jordan should have continued from the bench, though he’d come straight in at 10 obviously if Russell is out.

Clearly I’m not clued up on Darcy’s injury but I can’t beleive he’s in the the frame. Rowe has always done well with his opportunities so very happy for him to come straight in.

[Cameo]

Chessum in for for Martin for them. Otherwise stays the same (with M Smith at full back). I think Chessum improves them, the kind of dynamic lock we are missing.

They'll be confident and an improvement in results was coming, but one win in a very strange game doesn't meam they have solved their issues. I read Puja's minute by minute (which I love) and his conclusion is that France did not actually drop the ball with the line gaping as much as people thought (covering defenders, good pressure etc.), but the sheer number of dropped balls is still striking. Even if they weren't walkins, they were situations where France might well have scored in the next few phases. I still believe if you play that game again, France win.

Problem is that we can't play like France!

[Cameo]

In terms of our team, I would go something like:

Pack

1. Sutherland
2. Ashman (Cherry has been decent but we need more in the front 5)
3. Fagerson
4. Gilchrist
5. I really don't know - we need more dynamism but our fit options either don't have it or have no experience - Skinner is a safe option but a bit meh, do we gamble on Brown or Henderson?
6. Ritchie (don't want to drop Fagerson but he'll do damage off the bench and I think we need Ritchie's scrappiness)
7. Darge
8. Mann (again, fixing the wrong problem but let's throw something new at them)

Appreciate that doesn't solve much, but we just don't have the players to suddenly pick a pack that will get us go forward. I can equally see a logic to basically rolling out the same pack we had - it was picked for a reason.

9. Dobie (let's get some new energy - I recognise the downsides)
10. Russell (if fit)
11. Rowe (ai'm not comfortable picking Graham even if cleared, but suppose I will trust the doctors)
12. McDowall
13. Jones
14 VDM
15. Kinghorn (though he is a big culprit in our bad performances)

16 . Schoeman (although wouldn't be anti bringing Bhatti in)
17. Cherry (needs to be phased out after this)
18. Hurd
19. Skinner/Brown/Henderson
20. Fagerson
21. White
22. Jordan
23. Redpath (if we had a good back three option left I would put him here - maybe this is the time for a 6-2 with Dempsey too)

I just don't know. The Ireland game felt like a bit of a watershed, but Townsend might say we need to keep our cool as similar teams have beaten everyine but Ireland.

[Mikey Brown]

I definitely share the concerns at lock. Would be tempted to give Henderson a go but who knows what it is he’s missing in training so far.

Dropping both Fagerson and Dempsey would feel a bit mad to be honest, especially when we’re struggling for grunt in the carry. One or the other maybe, but both I’d say are vital in the 23.

Ritchie at 6 does appeal though. Someone a bit more vocal and more of a breakdown/lineout threat. Seems to have got particularly good at tapping back restarts too.

Ashman has to show a lot more to displace Cherry, for me. Ireland game was horrible but Cherry’s security at the lineout has been very welcome. Itoje and Chessum will definitely be more disruptive than with Martin there too.

Ashman I think is suited to bringing some physicality and carrying off the bench but I don’t know that’s he’s really got the nuts and bolts down.

I think I’d be sick if I saw VDM wearing the 14 shirt.

I like Dobie. Have we actually seen him paired with Finn at halfback?

Only go 6:2 if we’ve actually got a plan to inject something extra with 2 locks/backrows. With the options available I just don’t see who that would be.

[BaldiePete]

I think Cameo has got confused and put Rowe and DVDM on the wrong wings. Other than that, I can see the logic in those selections but it would be a very courageous selection to make (one for the Yes Minister fans there). Agree we shouldn’t be risking Graham who definitely got the worst of the collision with Russell. I don’t think he will make such big changes in the back row, but I would be very interested to see how Mann goes, he seems to be a good ball carrier for Glasgow and we could do with that. More likely on the bench than starting I’d say. At scrum half, I like to see Horne involved, most likely on the bench in a 5:3 split, with White starting. If it’s 6:2 we’ll need Dobie.

[septic 9]

Jack Mann has been a revelation but a wee bit of caution. He has now played 10 games of professional rugby. One in the challenge cup 2 years ago, 9 this season, not all against top opposition

[Mikey Brown]

Yeah. He’s filled in fantastically for Glasgow, but the idea he will come on and offer more than Fagerson or Dempsey at this point doesn’t seem likely.

I’d be thrilled to have the option when one or both aren’t available, but they are and they’re two of our best players. If any of them could realistically play lock it would be a different prospect but I don’t see space in a side for 3 number 8s.

[BaldiePete]

I don’t see space in a side for 3 number 8s.

I’m old enough to remember when we played five number 8s. Different days, actually pretty much a different sport.

[Cameo]

I definitely share the concerns at lock. Would be tempted to give Henderson a go but who knows what it is he’s missing in training so far.

Dropping both Fagerson and Dempsey would feel a bit mad to be honest, especially when we’re struggling for grunt in the carry. One or the other maybe, but both I’d say are vital in the 23.

Ritchie at 6 does appeal though. Someone a bit more vocal and more of a breakdown/lineout threat. Seems to have got particularly good at tapping back restarts too.

Ashman has to show a lot more to displace Cherry, for me. Ireland game was horrible but Cherry’s security at the lineout has been very welcome. Itoje and Chessum will definitely be more disruptive than with Martin there too.

Ashman I think is suited to bringing some physicality and carrying off the bench but I don’t know that’s he’s really got the nuts and bolts down.

I think I’d be sick if I saw VDM wearing the 14 shirt.

I like Dobie. Have we actually seen him paired with Finn at halfback?

Only go 6:2 if we’ve actually got a plan to inject something extra with 2 locks/backrows. With the options available I just don’t see who that would be.

Ah, I probably agree re Fagerson and Dempsey. My thing is that I want Ritchie in and, while fully acknowledging Mann is inexperienced (and less good realistically), I would be excited to see what he can offer. Chucking an unknown in can have its benefits.

And maybe on Cherry/Ashman if we are just talking this game.

It just seems weak when our main issue is front five that hasn't been offering enough to do nothing. Ashman at least has potential to address some of our issues (and his throwing has been decent when he has come on).

Don't care about numbering of wings - was in a rush.

[Mikey Brown]

Was only joking about the wings. You just get weirdly used to a player wearing a certain number.

Maybe I’ve read Mann a bit wrong, but I think he offers a similar game to our existing 2 options. It’s not like he’s a Ross Vintcent or a real wildcard, is it?

Totally agree we need some fresh input, but to me makes sense to do that in the weakest area at lock. Henderson might have some useful input on the England/Leicester lock pair, but obviously that works both ways.

I desperately want Jonny Gray to show some sort of fight in the contact. I’d stick him on the bench and see if he can up the aggression/impact somehow. I thought he might be rejuvenated but he looks ploddier than ever.

An hour of Cherry then let Ashman bash people works for me, for now at least.

[Cameo]

Yeah, wouldn't mind seeing Henderson but just haven't seen enough of/from him to really be calling for it. His late call up and then them bringing Skinner onto the bench ahead of him having not been in the original squad doesn't suggest they see him as a likely starter.

[Cameo]

Seems to be some chat that Brown will start, ehich I could live with.

At the same time, he was talking about the struggles at the breakdown vs Ireland. It doesn't get talked about that much because, without deep analysis, it is hard to pinpoint what and who's to blame, but realistically our issues at the breakdown are the main reason we can't compete against Ireland. They just know how to slow up our ball.

[Mikey Brown]

Accuracy, intensity and resourcing the breakdown is of course an issue, but it's a bit chicken and egg in terms of cause/effect with the inconsistent and inneffective passing, carrying, alignment and variety in attack. Not a cheery response, but there you go. Ireland are fantastic at slowing our attacking ball, but so are we.

I'm not against seeing Brown get a go, though I can't say he's particularly struck me with any of his involvements so far. Maybe wearing the same headgear as Jonny Gray hasn't helped.

[Mikey Brown]

15 Kinghorn
14 Rowe
13 Jones
12 Jordan
11 VDM
10 Russell
9 White

8 Dempsey
7 Darge
6 Ritchie
5 Gray
4 Gilchrist
3 Fagerson
2 Cherry
1 Schoeman

16 Ashman
17 Sutherland
18 Hurd
19 Skinner
20 Brown
21 Fagerson
22 Dobie
23 McDowall

[BaldiePete]

FFS - he’s kept Gray and gone 6:2. Backs are OK but I’m not convinced about those forwards.

[switchskier]

Disappointed not to see changes in the second row to add more dynamism, especially as the English pack are pretty athletic. Also not a fan of the Jordan/Jones combo in midfield. Think that there's a reason that Glasgow pretty much never play them together and would rather McDowall's direct running.

Think we might get blown out early and never recover.

[Cameo]

Disappointed not to see changes in the second row to add more dynamism, especially as the English pack are pretty athletic. Also not a fan of the Jordan/Jones combo in midfield. Think that there's a reason that Glasgow pretty much never play them together and would rather McDowall's direct running.

Think we might get blown out early and never recover.

Agree. Having said that, while I would have made changes to the pack, they would more be because it feels we have to change something rather than based on any real beloef they would solve the issue.

Hard not to be negative, but have to remember very similar teams have been England repeatedly over the last few years (and have lost to Ireland in similar ways). Not a lot has changed, though I think England have been looking better for a while.

Big game for Ritchie and Darge and we need Kinghorn to be on top form.

[Which Tyler]

Am I weird in feeling robbed that we won't be seeing Hill v Bayliss, preferably in the same position, coming on at the same time?

[Mikey Brown]

Disappointed not to see changes in the second row to add more dynamism, especially as the English pack are pretty athletic. Also not a fan of the Jordan/Jones combo in midfield. Think that there's a reason that Glasgow pretty much never play them together and would rather McDowall's direct running.

Think we might get blown out early and never recover.

Agree. Having said that, while I would have made changes to the pack, they would more be because it feels we have to change something rather than based on any real beloef they would solve the issue.

Hard not to be negative, but have to remember very similar teams have been England repeatedly over the last few years (and have lost to Ireland in similar ways). Not a lot has changed, though I think England have been looking better for a while.

Very well summed up, in spite of all its contradictions.

If this was the opening round and we put that 23 out the confidence might still be fairly high. The manner of defeat last week seems to have drained a lot of the belief in bouncing back, or that a bounce back would only be temporary, but hopefully the players themselves are a bit more resilient than we are.

There’s still a lot of talent in that squad, but this ‘we have to be at 100% to be in it’ mindset isn’t great as a supporter.

[switchskier]

Anyone know which match the image from the latest BBC article is from? Looks like a red card all day long.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/a ... 2d8gxmze6o

[BaldiePete]

That’s the 2023 jersey.

[BaldiePete]

Bhatti has replaced Sutherland on the bench. Sutherland has a back injury.

[paddy no 11]

Kinghorn being really poor again

Mcdowall on at q2 ASAP