Armitage was apparently 5ft9, that is pretty short. Is height an advantage at 8? Being shorter would mean a lower centre of gravity and be hard to put down. Finding someone of that height with the frame to carry the required weight and still be able to get around the park is fairly rare though.
I think the height is because, traditionally, the 8 would have jumped. Nowadays there’s a lot more flexibility over roles, and the player who plays 8 should just be the best at picking up from the base, really.
Seems more the role of the 6 being the third jumper these days. Ideally you want your best carrier available to run an attacking play off the lineout and not be taking the ball.
Picking up from the base seems to be only done in emergencies these days, being able to control the ball at the base is still a skill mind. Watch Rassie bring back the 8s ability to pick and inter link from the base with a trick play (the Boks will somehow use the winger in this) and then it'll be back in vogue.
Any chance RFU can pony up to buy Rassie out of his current contract?
I think the height is because, traditionally, the 8 would have jumped. Nowadays there’s a lot more flexibility over roles, and the player who plays 8 should just be the best at picking up from the base, really.
Seems more the role of the 6 being the third jumper these days. Ideally you want your best carrier available to run an attacking play off the lineout and not be taking the ball.
Picking up from the base seems to be only done in emergencies these days, being able to control the ball at the base is still a skill mind. Watch Rassie bring back the 8s ability to pick and inter link from the base with a trick play (the Boks will somehow use the winger in this) and then it'll be back in vogue.
Any chance RFU can pony up to buy Rassie out of his current contract?
Cause people loved it when we had Eddie Jones, another controversial advocate for ripping up the accepted rugby playbook.
Seems more the role of the 6 being the third jumper these days. Ideally you want your best carrier available to run an attacking play off the lineout and not be taking the ball.
Picking up from the base seems to be only done in emergencies these days, being able to control the ball at the base is still a skill mind. Watch Rassie bring back the 8s ability to pick and inter link from the base with a trick play (the Boks will somehow use the winger in this) and then it'll be back in vogue.
Any chance RFU can pony up to buy Rassie out of his current contract?
Cause people loved it when we had Eddie Jones, another controversial advocate for ripping up the accepted rugby playbook.
Trouble is when we have the more “conventional thinkers”: Rowell, Robinson, Jonno, Burt and most recently Shortbread Bakery - where do we inevitably end up?
Just as an exercise on shape/balance, assuming availability, maybe our 4 best backrowers in terms of skill/ceiling are Willis, Willis, T Curry and Pollock. If TC was unavailable, how would the other three line up (just as an example to make the point)?
You'd want JW free to jackal as perhaps the best at winning back ball lost to the opposition so play him at 6 or 7?
You'd want TW carrying to best effect so 6 or 8?
You'd want HP to jump at the lineout sometimes, be free in the loose sometimes and do defensive covering with his pace - so 6,7 or 8?
The point is that the shirt numbers matter not one bit. A versatile trio do different jobs at different times and don't even do the same jobs all the time. One classic example would be picking up from the base of the scrum - TW to hit heavy traffic, attract multi-defenders and create space; HP to cut loose if gaps might appear.
I'm only trying to suggest that we need to get creative with such superb back row resources (whichever personalities start). Pigeonholing along lines of traditional roles and number labels is irrelevant. We have good enough players to outplay any other backrows provided that the coaching is good enough.
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 12:29 pm
Oh Jesus. I’ve got some horrible, shocking news for you regarding Jack Willis.
Substitute any names you like. I was just making a point about traditional shirt number roles. It seemed to demonstrate the point best with those three.
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Thu Sep 25, 2025 12:29 pm
Oh Jesus. I’ve got some horrible, shocking news for you regarding Jack Willis.
Substitute any names you like. I was just making a point about traditional shirt number roles. It seemed to demonstrate the point best with those three.
I feel France have the gold standard re back row Cros, Ollivon and Alldrit are incredibly well balanced as a starting trio then with the likes of Woki and Macalou coming in to give some impact then it’s very hard for any England side to counter that combination of shear size and pace. Only players we have in that conversation are Underhill, CCS and Willis brothers and we let one go!
Post script I might add Ted Hill to the above if Slip Boundary gives him a proper run out in AIs
Substitute any names you like. I was just making a point about traditional shirt number roles. It seemed to demonstrate the point best with those three.